Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Paul Hamilton is one of the first persons to become a DPE (Designated Pilot Examiner) for sport pilots. As a full-time author and sport pilot expert, he writes books and produces DVD's for Aviation Supplies and Academics (ASA). Now Paul has graciously agreed to answer your questions here. Thanks Paul! For more information about Paul, please visit www.Paul-Hamilton.com and www.Sport-Pilot-Training.com.

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AviatorCrafty
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Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby AviatorCrafty » Sat Mar 07, 2020 10:14 pm

I may be doing some flying with my old CFI in a 172 just for fun and a little bit of an intro to flight instructing/instructing (won't be counting it since he hasn't been an instructor for 24 months) in general since I'm getting my AGI for now, but will eventually get my CFI-S and I'll be training with an appropriate CFI for that when the time comes. My question is would I be able to count the landings in the 172 towards my passenger-carrying currency? I read on the AOPA sport pilot page that a sport pilot could do a flight review in a non-lsa so I thought maybe these would count too but just making sure.
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drseti
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Re: Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby drseti » Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:08 am

I can't cite an FAR on this, but I believe passenger currency TOLs have to be done as PIC. Since you can't be PIC in a non-LSA without a CFI onboard or a solo endorsement (which your friend can't give you as a lapsed CFI). So, the answer would be no.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
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Re: Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby drseti » Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:18 am

I think I found the answer on FAR 61.57(a):

(ii) The required takeoffs and landings were performed in an aircraft of the same category, class, and type (if a type rating is required),


If the category and class of aircraft in which you wish to carry passengers is SLSA, Airplane, the TOLs would more count.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
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Re: Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby FastEddieB » Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:20 am

Here's what the regs say:

[1]..no person may act as a pilot in command of an aircraft carrying passengers or of an aircraft certificated for more than one pilot flight crewmember unless that person has made at least three takeoffs and three landings within the preceding 90 days, and—

(i) The person acted as the sole manipulator of the flight controls; and

(ii) The required takeoffs and landings were performed in an aircraft of the same category, class, and type (if a type rating is required), and, if the aircraft to be flown is an airplane with a tailwheel, the takeoffs and landings must have been made to a full stop in an airplane with a tailwheel.[/i]

So, you'd have (i) covered. Now regarding (ii) the question is, are a C172 and a Light Sport in the same category and class. This still confuses me sometimes with the introduction of Light Sport, but I think the Professor has a pretty good handle on this and can opine.

Note: composed and posted before the Professor responded.
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drseti
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Re: Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby drseti » Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:35 am

FastEddieB wrote:the question is, are a C172 and a Light Sport in the same category and class. This still confuses me sometimes with the introduction of Light Sport, but I think the Professor has a pretty good handle on this and can opine.


Oh, the professor can always opine. Whether he's right or wrong, Eddie, is another question. :wink:

The situation is confusing, because there are three different definitions of Category and Class - one for training, another for maintenance, and a third for pilot privileges. If in doubt as to which applies, my tendency is to go with the most restrictive interpretation, until shown otherwise.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
fly@AvSport.org
AvSport.org
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Re: Takeoffs and Landings in non-LSA towards passenger currency

Postby AviatorCrafty » Sun Mar 08, 2020 10:07 am

drseti wrote:I can't cite an FAR on this, but I believe passenger currency TOLs have to be done as PIC. Since you can't be PIC in a non-LSA without a CFI onboard or a solo endorsement (which your friend can't give you as a lapsed CFI). So, the answer would be no.


Realized I may have added some confusion here, he is an active CFI, just hasn't held it for the required 24 months to count for CFI instruction. I also thought I couldn't log PIC while dual in a non-LSA.
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