The Sport Pilot Rating

Finally, a place for sport pilot instructors and/or wannabees to talk about instructing.

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bryancobb
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Location: Cartersville Georgia

The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by bryancobb »

Hi Everyone,

I have experienced excitement to anger to the dulldrums to excitement again about the sport pilot regulations.

I have recently looked in the mirror and saw that the sport pilot rating's time has come and gone. The reasons will be covered below. First, Dr. Paul's thread about difficulty finding a DPE nearby. There's practically no financial advantage of doing the sport rating instead of the private rating. My local FBO has three 172's for rent that were all built after 2000. Instructors are easy to schedule. DPE is just a short distance and a quick phonecall away.

The final thing that doomed the sport rating is when Basic Med was enacted and a student can (just like a sport student) get their license without a FAA Medical certificate.

I loved flying ultralights. I loved flying 2-seat "fat" ultralights. I loved teaching in Kitfoxes without a Medical. I can now rent any airplane up to 6 passengers and 6000 pound takeoff weight, and take my family away on a long IFR cross country ...WITHOUT A MEDICAL.

Times have truly changed. For a student prospect, I say go get your Private License. You can then fly ANY LSA, legally without any endorsement. And you can fly most general aviation aircraft at the nearby airport. You don't have to pay for a DPE to get on Delta to come give you a checkride. Rental aircraft are plentiful. CFI's are plentiful. It's just a LOT less hassle.
Bryan Cobb
Sport Pilot CFI
Commercial/Instrument Airplane
Commercial Rotorcraft Helicopter
Manufacturing Engineer II, Meggitt Airframe Systems, Fuel Systems & Composites Group
Cartersville, Ga
[email protected]
3Dreaming
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by 3Dreaming »

bryancobb wrote: The final thing that doomed the sport rating is when Basic Med was enacted and a student can (just like a sport student) get their license without a FAA Medical certificate.
A student pilot with no flying background can not just use Basic Med. They have to get at least one physical to be eligible for Basic Med.
chicagorandy
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by chicagorandy »

One hopes that other Sport Pilot CFI's like yourself do not share your opinion of the rating or for that matter your understanding of the way Basic Med actually works for newcomers to aviation..
"Don't believe everything you read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln
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Warmi
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by Warmi »

Sport Pilot still makes sense for people who don't want to go thru the trouble ( or can't) of getting at least one physical.

If you can , then by all means, going private makes more sense and you can still fly any Light Sport you desire - no argument here.
Flying Sting S4 ( N184WA ) out of Illinois
TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by TimTaylor »

As has already been stated, you cannot do Basic Med unless you held a valid 3rd class or higher FAA medical certificate within 10 years prior to 7/15/2016 (after 7/14/2006). I doubt many new students would meet this requirement, without getting a new FAA medical.

I think a high percentage of students for a Sport Pilot certificate are older people who don't want to risk failing an FAA medical. The Sport Pilot certificate is an excellent vehicle to allow these people to take up a new hobby in retirement or approaching retirement. Many of these people have the resources to purchase and own a new LSA.

As far as DPE's being available, Lanier at KGVL trains quite a few Sport Pilots. There is an examiner around here somewhere. I think he might be at Anderson, SC.
Retired from flying.
nub_pilot
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by nub_pilot »

I find the OP's position disheartening and I'll explain.

All my life I have wanted to fly, but the Navy (20+ year career on Submarines flying under the water) was my primary focus, then came the kids and family. now I'm retired from the Navy, kids out of the house, and wife and I are in a great financial state to allow me to afford all the training.

When I retired from the Navy I have some issues and was awarded a certain level of disability. While I feel these disabilities do not hamper my ability to operate an aircraft, the FAA would consider it differently. I have spoken to 2 senior AME and received the same recommendation; "while its not impossible to clear a 3rd class, it would be a huge challenge and expensive, which could still end ups with a denial." This was a total heart breaker as I has my heart set on PPL, IFR, and Multi ratings. With all this gone to crap, I started looking into Sport Pilot certificate. Refocused my passion towards that line of training.

I have spent a good 3-4 months in researching EVERYTHING dealing with LSA aircraft and trying to find a CFI with a plane to train me in (I'm a little over the standard limit of 210). Found the only one in my own state (45min drive) and took my first lesson. Absolutely loved it and wanted an aggressive lesson plan. 1 week later the CFI was up with another student and had some troubles. Plane took some damage and both were okay, but now with the plane OOC, I am once again on the search for another avenue.

Back to the OP's position, if other CFI-S have the same thought, then I will NEVER be able to pursue my life dream of one day taking my plane out for a ride or attending the EAA expo in my home city (which I haven't been back to in 20+ years).

I know there are passionate CFI-S out there and mine was one of them, but unfortunate circumstances has placed both of us in this dilemma. With the potential of the FAA relaxing some of the LSA restrictions would open up new possibilities in qualified planes, but I'm not hold my breath and wouldn't expect anything for another couple of years.

Sorry for the rant and if anyone knows CFI with an LSA in CT, sent me a PM. I'm willing to set an aggressive plan to get this completed.
Jeremy
TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by TimTaylor »

You should ignore this thread. The OP, a CFI-S, does not understand Basic Med, but that does not apply to you anyway. Also, any CFI can instruct a student toward a Sport Pilot certificate. You do, however, need to find an LSA to train in and a CFI (Sport or otherwise) to train you. Keep looking. It will happen.

One other thought...I don't know your disability and don't want to know it. However, even a Sport Pilot flying with a driver's license as a medical is obligated to self-evaluate his or her ability to safely operate an aircraft. Make sure you are confident you can do that before you start spending money on flying lessons.

PS: I lived in Neenah, Wi from 1975 to 1980.
Retired from flying.
nub_pilot
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by nub_pilot »

Thanks Tim and I completely understand about self evaluations. I had to act on them all last week while I was sick, but I so wanted to get back in the air. I know I couldn't concentrate with my allergies going crazy and having a headache.

It makes me frustrated to read these articles from people that everyone should get their PPL and disregard getting the lowly Sport Pilot cert. I for one am glad the FAA has opened up this new chapter for people to pursue their passion of flying even though they may not be able to clear a 3rd class.

On another side, it does seem a bit scary to think about people operating under LSA restrictions and could have questionable disabilities. to me this is the same thought of older people that are still driving cars and when you ride with them, you think to yourself "they shouldn't be driving any more" but understand that that could be the last large piece of freedom they have and don't ever want to loose it. How many people are flying under LSA and think "my body aches a little, but I'm sure I'm fine to fly today?"

thank Tim for all your feedback and recommendation. I've gotten my study books out again and am starting to reread them again as a refresher.

I have the persistence and know one day I WILL finish this chapter of my life and be able to enjoy the freedoms of flying.
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Warmi
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by Warmi »

Don’t give up.

I am about your age and finally got the time and money to try to make it happen ...
Took me about a year and a half but I bought a LSA , found myself an instructor , finished my training, got my license and now I am free to drive to my hangar anytime , get into my plane and fly , maybe even only for 20 minutes after work before it gets dark ....or for 3 hours on a weekend if I wish so.

It is not cheap ... between paying for my insurance, the hangar and maintenance but it is reasonably affordable if you have a decent salary and remember, you live only once anyway.
Last edited by Warmi on Fri May 31, 2019 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Flying Sting S4 ( N184WA ) out of Illinois
TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by TimTaylor »

Also, don't feel like you would be missing out on a lot as a Sport Pilot. I have been flying with Sport Pilot privileges for the past 6 years after almost 50 years flying as instrument rated Private, Commercial, and Flight Instructor. While I did enjoy flying larger single and multi-engine aircraft in VFR and IFR weather, day and night, I find now, as I get older, I get just as much enjoyment flying a Cessna SkyCatcher in daytime VFR with only one passenger. Flying is flying. It's all good.
Retired from flying.
nub_pilot
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by nub_pilot »

Warmi wrote:Don’t give up.

I am about your age and finally got the time and money to try to make it happen ...
Took me about a year and a half but I bought a LSA , found myself an instructor , finished my training, got my license and now I am free to drive to my hangar anytime , get into my plane and fly , maybe even only for 20 minutes after work before it gets dark, or for 3 hours on a weekend if I wish so.

It is not cheap ... between paying for my insurance, the hangar and maintenance but it is reasonably affordable if you have a decent salary and remember, you live only once anyway.
Thanks for the encouragement, I might have to look at doing the same (buy a plane and find and instructor).

I absolutely love the Sting S4 and have noticed they have the most "useful load" and would easily carry me and an instructor my size....plug almost full of fuel. the down side is that they are too far outside my budget right now.

Thanks again to everyone.
TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by TimTaylor »

You can get a nice used LSA for around $60,000. I have always said you need a flying budget around $1,000 per month to support ownership of such an aircraft. It can be done cheaper, but in a less capable LSA. Not everyone here agrees with me on this, but you don't want to own an airplane you can't afford to fly due to the fixed cost of ownership.
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FastEddieB
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by FastEddieB »

nub_pilot wrote: On another side, it does seem a bit scary to think about people operating under LSA restrictions and could have questionable disabilities.
Especially scary when you consider the number of fatal accidents where Sport Pilots became physically incapacitated or compromised while flying, and crashed and died.

Oh. Wait...

This has not happened. Viewed as an experiment, allowing Light Sport pilots to self-certify has been a resounding success. I can’t think of a single fatality definitively linked to a medical condition or disability, that a 3rd Class Medical would have caught. No doubt it will happen someday, but it’s good to keep in mind that pilots with all classes of Medical - including First Class - have died behind the yoke as well.

I think it’s because self-preservation is a powerful instinct - no one wants to die on their next flight. Just always keep “The Most Conservative Action” mantra in mind - if in doubt as to any aspect of and given flight, sit it out. For everyone’s benefit.
Fast Eddie B.
Sky Arrow 600 E-LSA • N467SA
CFI, CFII, CFIME
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3Dreaming
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by 3Dreaming »

FastEddieB wrote:
I think it’s because self-preservation is a powerful instinct - no one wants to die on their next flight. Just always keep “The Most Conservative Action” mantra in mind - if in doubt as to any aspect of and given flight, sit it out. For everyone’s benefit.
The two worst things ever. A pilot getting up knowing today is his last flight, or getting up not knowing today is going to be his last flight.
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MrMorden
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Post by MrMorden »

I could probably get a 3rd Class medical, but I chose to go Sport Pilot. I just want to minimize the FAA in my life, and maintaining a medical just wasn’t something I was excited about.

Now that BasicMed is in play, I could get a single medical and fly as a PP...but why? I don’t want to fly IFR, and while I’d like to fly at night, I’d only do it a handful of times a year so that’s not a big deal. I’d have to do another checkride, which nobody likes. And at the end of the day, I love my CT and probably wouldn’t want to trade up to something bigger. I have not yet encountered I flight I could not make because I needed a bigger airplane. Plus my ELSA has the considerable advantage of self-maintenance.

I can do everything I need to complete my recreational flying mission with my SP rating. And I do think that within 5-10 years the Class 3 Medical will be going away, as it serves bery little safety purpose. SP was the first atep, BasicMed was the second. The FAA moves slowly, but it will get there eventually.
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
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