The Sport Pilot Rating

Finally, a place for sport pilot instructors and/or wannabees to talk about instructing.

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ShawnM
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Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:59 pm
Location: Clearwater, FL / KZPH

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby ShawnM » Wed Jul 31, 2019 7:35 pm

nub_pilot wrote:
TimTaylor wrote:Maybe you need to take two weeks vacation and go some where and "get 'er done."


I'd love to do that, do you have any recommendations.....I have the Hotel points and the vacation time at work.


First Landings in Apopka which is just about 20 minutes north of Orlando. They offer a two week accelerated course. I started my training here.

http://www.firstlandings.com/flight-training/sport-pilot-flight-training/

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WDD
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Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby WDD » Fri Aug 02, 2019 6:48 am

Yes, I feel the pain here. Lack of Sport CFI's, and lack of Sport Planes to rent.

BUT....
Any CFI can give you training hours up to solo in a non LSA plane, and they all count. You do need to go through several CFI's to find one that that will work with you - for some reason if they know you won't do the PPL route they are not interested. The hook is that you can only do your solo hours and check ride in a LSA.

Doesn't solve the problem of finding a LSA to get checked out in / transitioned, finding a new sport CFI who will pick up your training and endorse you for solo, and then eventually finding a LSA DPI. And when it's all done, you still have the problem of finding a plane to rent.

But you'll make some progress while searching. Maybe get 1/2 of your needed work done. And maybe you'll be able to figure out how to get the 3rd class medical in the meantime......

chicagorandy
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby chicagorandy » Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:04 am

I've been mulling over this whole Sport Pilot thing for more than a year now. Doing some pre-checks I am not able to pass a 3rd Class medical so Sport Pilot or Ultralights are my only realistic options. I was up at AirVenture for 9 days and frequently experienced just how often current pilots look down their nose at the notion of the Sport Pilot even existing.

My conclusions are:

1. If one can afford to buy, hangar and maintain their own LSA then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

2. If one cannot afford their own plane but a sufficient number of LSA rental aircraft and instructors are conveniently located to their home, then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

3. Failing #1 or #2 if one is satisfied with spending far more time commuting in their vehicle than actually flying in an airplane, then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

4. There is NO #4.
"Don't believe everything you read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln

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MrMorden
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Location: Athens, GA

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby MrMorden » Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:50 am

chicagorandy wrote:I've been mulling over this whole Sport Pilot thing for more than a year now. Doing some pre-checks I am not able to pass a 3rd Class medical so Sport Pilot or Ultralights are my only realistic options. I was up at AirVenture for 9 days and frequently experienced just how often current pilots look down their nose at the notion of the Sport Pilot even existing.

My conclusions are:

1. If one can afford to buy, hangar and maintain their own LSA then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

2. If one cannot afford their own plane but a sufficient number of LSA rental aircraft and instructors are conveniently located to their home, then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

3. Failing #1 or #2 if one is satisfied with spending far more time commuting in their vehicle than actually flying in an airplane, then the Sport Pilot rating is a wonderful thing to pursue.

4. There is NO #4.


My personal experience is that most folks that can afford to rent, can afford to own. The only catch is that they might not be able to own a "dream" airplane, and you might have to settle for something a bit more basic than you really want. I have a friend who bought an Avid Flyer for $12k six years ago and he still flies it several times a week and loves it. You also might have to park on the ramp instead of a hangar if you're trying to save money, and that will further restrict which airplanes are suitable. But something like a Luscomb, Taylorcraft, or Ercoupe can be a fine airplane and can be had for $12-20k depending on condition. When you take away the additional travel time, rental insurance, etc and then add back in liability insurance and other fixed costs on an owned airplane, I think the per hour cost of owning a modest airplane can be close to rental costs if you are careful.

Chances are if you can't afford that level of financial commitment, you might not be able to fly enough to maintain proficiency in any airplane, even a rental. That's not a judgement, it's just a fact that aviation is not cheap.
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA

chicagorandy
Posts: 186
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:39 pm

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby chicagorandy » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:10 am

"it's just a fact that aviation is not cheap."

You know? I heard that once before, nice to get confirmation - lol As an inner-city resident of (oddly enough) Chicago, living just 2 miles East of Midway Airport, I can attest to the tithing placed on General Aviation as a pastime.

As I constantly lament - "Why oh why wasn't I born rich, instead of so good lookin'?"
"Don't believe everything you read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln

TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby TimTaylor » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:19 am

Many people who fly don't want to fly a "puddle jumper." When they fly, they want to fly something with enough speed and endurance to go somewhere. So, you can rent something such as that for $100 to $130 per hour. You may have a flying budget of $300 per month so you can fly 2 or 3 hours per month, plenty to stay proficient.

To purchase such an airplane would cost north of $50,000 and to own and fly such an aircraft would require a flying budget of $1000 per month or close to it. So, there are many people for whom renting is the only viable option. There is nothing wrong with renting if you can find something to rent. Renting is preferable to owning in many cases.
Commercial Pilot Airplane Single & Multiengine Land; Instrument Airplane
Sport Endorsement Airplane Single Engine Sea
Flight Instructor Airplane Single & Multiengine
Ground Instructor Advanced Instrument
BS Engineering NC State
MBA Wisconsin

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MrMorden
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Location: Athens, GA

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby MrMorden » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:33 am

Any airplane that can fly 100mph is perfectly capable of "going somewhere". At that speed You can go 800 miles in a day if you fly two four-hour legs...how far do you need to go to be "going somewhere" and not just jumping puddles?

You can sometimes find Jabiru-powered Sonex airplanes in the $20k range. That's a Sport-legal airplane that will go 150mph at altitude. There are plenty of low cost options that will let you go places at good speed.

Many people consider all LSA to be "puddle jumpers". But I have flown to Michigan from my home in Georgia in a six hours, back from Oshkosh in 5.5 hours, and to Norman, Oklahoma in about 7 hours. It all depends on what you consider practical travel, but even an 80mph ground speed beats driving a car the same distance by a good margin.
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA

TimTaylor
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Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby TimTaylor » Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:01 pm

When I say "puddle jumper," I'm talking a plane that cruises at 65 knots with an endurance of 3 hours and maybe no electrical system, etc. Not much better than an ultralight. I think we all agree that 100 knots with 4 hours endurance is fine. That doesn't mean that people who can afford to rent can afford to own. Some can, some can't. And some have better ways to spend or invest their hard earned cash. I could easily afford to own a J3, but at this point in my life and flying career, I wouldn't want to. I have many hours in a J3, but it's not what I want to fly now. I could afford to own almost any LSA made, but at this point in my life and flying career, that's not where I want to spend or invest my money. Again, there is absolutely nothing wrong with renting and renting is preferable to many pilots for many reasons. Fortunately for me, I've always (7 years) had access to an LSA I love 40 mile from my house. If that ever changes, I will have to make other arrangements if I want to continue to fly.
Commercial Pilot Airplane Single & Multiengine Land; Instrument Airplane
Sport Endorsement Airplane Single Engine Sea
Flight Instructor Airplane Single & Multiengine
Ground Instructor Advanced Instrument
BS Engineering NC State
MBA Wisconsin

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bryancobb
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Location: Cartersville Georgia

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby bryancobb » Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:11 am

Food for thought.

I got a Private License in FW/SEL in 1985 who probably could not pass a Class III physical these days. I and my Family Doctor both agree that I most likely do not pose a safety threat to aviation when I do the type flying I want to (I.E. Typical stuff a Sport Pilot wants to do).

I just bought a Lycoming-Powered Piper Tomahawk that has always had a current annual. I got it for less than $20,000 and am currently trying to get the FAA to approve a LODA for me to teach ONE STUDENT (my 15 year old daughter) to fly toward her Private Ticket in it with my SPORT CFI rating. I realize a Subpart H CFI will need to train her on PTS tasks that are not in the Sport PTS but are in the Private Pilot PTS. That instructor will do her last 3 hours of checkride prep.

I tie the metal airplane down outside for ($50) per month. I have zero insurance and don't have very much property or money to be sued for, so if someone does, it will cost them more than they get. I am not a cowboy and I fly safely and per the FAR's. It burns 6 gallons per hour ($30). I expect to solo my daughter on her 16th birthday and have her ready for her Private checkride on her 17th, with very close to 40 hours in her logbook. I expect to have all this done well before the Lycoming O-235 engine reaches its 2000 hour TBO. The final step will be to sell the Tomahawk for no less than I gave for it.

You can aviate on a homeless budget. Her Private License should cost us less than $1000.
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Bryan Cobb
Sport Pilot CFI
Commercial/Instrument Airplane
Commercial Rotorcraft Helicopter
Manufacturing Engineer II, Meggitt Airframe Systems, Fuel Systems & Composites Group
Cartersville, Ga
bryandcobb@att.net

TimTaylor
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Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:17 pm

Re: The Sport Pilot Rating

Postby TimTaylor » Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:29 am

I would not fly without liability insurance. If I injure or kill someone else, they deserve compensation without having to sue me (but they will), IMHO. Liability insurance is not very expensive.
Commercial Pilot Airplane Single & Multiengine Land; Instrument Airplane
Sport Endorsement Airplane Single Engine Sea
Flight Instructor Airplane Single & Multiengine
Ground Instructor Advanced Instrument
BS Engineering NC State
MBA Wisconsin


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