New Pilot in North Carolina

Pilot? Student pilot? Future pilot? Interested in learning to fly? If you're reading this forum, you've got flying in your blood! SportPilotTalk is a great place to ask questions about this exciting new segment of (more) affordable aviation!

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ShawnM
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby ShawnM » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:08 am

drseti wrote:
ShawnM wrote:she also, like Dave C, bought a used Sportstar just like the plane she trained in.


One of my graduates bought the very plane he trained in! The day he passed his checkride, while the DPE was still filling out the paperwork, he made me a very fair offer on my first SportStar.


Sounds like a good day for all involved. :D

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Warmi
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Warmi » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:50 am

I am curious why people are even considering purchasing planes used for flight training.
There is no significant discount there since , say a 2008 Evektor will cost about the same regardless if it comes from a flight school or a private owner - the only difference is that the one from the flight school will have something like 1500 hours vs a more typical 300-500 hours for a privately owned one.

There is nothing to be gained since , despite best intentions , school airplanes will have really hard landings , sometimes even undetected , especially if the plane is available for rent.

I guess I just don’t see any upside for buying a plane like that ...
Flying Sting S4 ( N184WA ) out of Illinois

Type47
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Type47 » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:59 am

I understand the use of the phrase “old and tired”, however, these aircraft are not like cars that deteriorate over the years until it is more economical to replace them.
As a retired auto mechanic, I have often considered how different cars would be if everyone was required to keep them up to an operating standard and repair based on an annual inspection.
Back to airplanes. If the engine suffers power loss, you must repair. Any and all controlls must meet standards yearly.
There are 100 year old planes that fly just like when they were new. Sometimes better.
My 2006 Tecnam flies exactly like the new Eaglet.
My engine has a couple hundred hours on it since overhaul.
I took a student pilot for a ride last year and while we were flying around, he asked me if my plane was new.
Some people want new and are willing to pay the price.
Some, like me, like older well maintained vehicles. And spend way less money.
You do not have to spend anywhere near $100,000 to own a modern light sport plane.
Type47
LSRI
2006 Tecnam P92 Echo Super ELSA
I’m not a singing grampa.

Type47
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Type47 » Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:19 am

Warmi wrote:I am curious why people are even considering purchasing planes used for flight training.
There is no significant discount there since , say a 2008 Evektor will cost about the same regardless if it comes from a flight school or a private owner - the only difference is that the one from the flight school will have something like 1500 hours vs a more typical 300-500 hours for a privately owned one.

There is nothing to be gained since , despite best intentions , school airplanes will have really hard landings , sometimes even undetected , especially if the plane is available for rent.

I guess I just don’t see any upside for buying a plane like that ...



My Tecnam P92E was Lockwood’s trainer. It had just over 2000 hrs on it with the engine recently done by them. I bought it from a broker in clearwater and spent around $15-20k less for it than comparable privately owned planes. Many of the other planes in the same year range and price had the 1500 hr Rotax with the case fretting issue unresolved. If the issue was addressed, they wanted $20,000 more for the plane.
I came to the conclusion that an airplane with all service performed, all issues addressed every 100 hours, with $15,000 of engine work recently done for a savings of $15,000 or more was a good deal.
Of course, I had a Tecnam mechanic of my choice fly to it and do a proper pre-buy.
Two years/annuals including rubber replace later, nothing but normal wear and tear has been found.
Both annuals were at Tecnam service centers and both commented on the great condition of the aircraft.
Type47
LSRI
2006 Tecnam P92 Echo Super ELSA
I’m not a singing grampa.

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ShawnM
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby ShawnM » Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:40 pm

Type47 wrote:I understand the use of the phrase “old and tired”, however, these aircraft are not like cars that deteriorate over the years until it is more economical to replace them.
As a retired auto mechanic, I have often considered how different cars would be if everyone was required to keep them up to an operating standard and repair based on an annual inspection.
Back to airplanes. If the engine suffers power loss, you must repair. Any and all controlls must meet standards yearly.
There are 100 year old planes that fly just like when they were new. Sometimes better.
My 2006 Tecnam flies exactly like the new Eaglet.
My engine has a couple hundred hours on it since overhaul.
I took a student pilot for a ride last year and while we were flying around, he asked me if my plane was new.
Some people want new and are willing to pay the price.
Some, like me, like older well maintained vehicles. And spend way less money.
You do not have to spend anywhere near $100,000 to own a modern light sport plane.


I wholeheartedly agree with you on this. I think my 2007 looks very good for her age and there's not a drop of oil in the engine cowling even after 900 hours. In fact, I've seen pics on the SportCruiser forum of newer planes than mine in surprisingly poor condition.

I think my 2007 also flies just as good or better than the new ones as it's more responsive and faster.

I just say "old and tired" because in today's disposable world anything that is now 12 years old is ready for the trash heap or recycle bin. My plane is in great shape and I'm always upgrading or improving something on her. She should last me uh.........FOREVER. :mrgreen:

TimTaylor
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby TimTaylor » Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:50 pm

I think people purchase the plane they can afford (or think they can afford). Some have the money for a new $150,000 to $200,000 airplane while others might afford or allocate only $50,000. If your budget is $50,000, an older, high time trainer might fit the bill nicely.
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ShawnM
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby ShawnM » Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:30 pm

TimTaylor wrote:I think people purchase the plane they can afford (or think they can afford). Some have the money for a new $150,000 to $200,000 airplane while others might afford or allocate only $50,000. If your budget is $50,000, an older, high time trainer might fit the bill nicely.


Yup, get in where you fit in. :mrgreen: I scraped all my loose change together and bought within my budget.

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Warmi
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Warmi » Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:25 pm

Yes of course of the price is right ( meaning lower ) then sure, there is incentive to get a trainer but my question was related to the fact that I often see trainers being offered without any significant discounts ... I guess I was wondering if people go for trainers with the idea that , if that thing was able to handle 2000 hours of student abuse, it is probably tried and true- that kind of school of thought :)
Flying Sting S4 ( N184WA ) out of Illinois

TimTaylor
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby TimTaylor » Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:29 pm

I doubt that. They find a plane they like and can afford and have a thorough pre-purchase inspection performed. One bad landing can cause a great deal of damage to an LSA. It doesn't have to be a trainer to have damage history or hidden damage.

I have rented and flown 6 different SkyCatchers and Remos GX that were all rental/training aircraft. I would been happy to own any of them and actually bought one of the SkyCatchers before I got cold feet and backed out of the deal. Unfortunately, two of them were subsequently totalled and one was severely damaged.
Commercial Pilot Airplane Single & Multiengine Land; Instrument Airplane
Sport Endorsement Airplane Single Engine Sea
Flight Instructor Airplane Single & Multiengine
Ground Instructor Advanced Instrument

akroguy
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby akroguy » Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:15 pm

Back to the OP, welcome! This, from a fellow 2006 Sportstar owner. :D

It's been a great airplane, first annual with me as owner showed absolutely no surprises. Cheap to operate, nimble and the view is simply amazing. My wife hated flying our C-180...felt like being in a dark cavern to her. You don't ride IN a Sportstar, you ride ON it.
2006 Evektor Sportstar SE
E98 Los Lunas, NM

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drseti
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby drseti » Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:13 am

akroguy wrote: You don't ride IN a Sportstar, you ride ON it.


More like you strap it on and become part of it. Zen flying at its best!
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
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Dave C
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Dave C » Thu Mar 14, 2019 2:52 pm

BIG News. After four reschedulings I finally passed my checkride two days ago. I am now officially a sport pilot!

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drseti
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby drseti » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:03 pm

That IS big news. Well done, Dave! Welcome to the fraternity, brother.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
fly@AvSport.org
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
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Warmi
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Warmi » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:26 pm

I remember that awesome feeling ... now you don’t have to coordinate your solo flights with anyone ... maybe just with your own common sense :D which is always a good thing to do.

Congratulations.
Flying Sting S4 ( N184WA ) out of Illinois

Wm.Ince
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Re: New Pilot in North Carolina

Postby Wm.Ince » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:05 pm

Atta’ boy, Dave!
Congratulations. :D
Bill Ince
CTSW (E-LSA)
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator


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