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Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:48 pm
by Warmi
Flying is very unforgiving in a way that driving or frankly many other activities are not.

A mode of travel where you cannot slow down below certain ( still, relatively high ) speed or bad things will happen, and when you have to manage movement in 3 dimensions will always be more dangerous than driving.

What makes driving more dangerous than it should be, is the sheer number of other drivers you can't control and their close proximity - so frankly, I think what we have here is a comparison of apples and oranges - or, as MrMorden pointed out - with flying , it is as safe as you make it to be while with driving it is the other way around.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:48 pm
by Jim Hardin
Professional Flying is the key there Bill :wink:

I have given check outs & Flight Reviews to many pilots who left me scratching my head. Nothing I could/would bust them on but very mediocre skills and knowledge. I gave them some firm suggestions but there is only so much.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:02 pm
by drseti
Wm.Ince wrote: (excluding two combat flying tours in Vietnam) . . . the most dangerous part of it all was driving to and from the airport.
If we don't exclude Uncle Sam's All-Expense-Paid Asian Vacation, the most dangerous part of it all for me was one flight with Air America. (I never took a second...)

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:30 pm
by TimTaylor
Warmi wrote:Flying is very unforgiving in a way that driving or frankly many other activities are not.

A mode of travel where you cannot slow down below certain ( still, relatively high ) speed or bad things will happen, and when you have to manage movement in 3 dimensions will always be more dangerous than driving.

What makes driving more dangerous than it should be, is the sheer number of other drivers you can't control and their close proximity - so frankly, I think what we have here is a comparison of apples and oranges - or, as MrMorden pointed out - with flying , it is as safe as you make it to be while with driving it is the other way around.
I disagree. I don't know the statistics, but I think driving a car is much more dangerous than flying an airplane. There's a lot more to hit and a lot more idiots on the road.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:46 pm
by Wm.Ince
drseti wrote:If we don't exclude Uncle Sam's All-Expense-Paid Asian Vacation, the most dangerous part of it all for me was one flight with Air America. (I never took a second...)
I never flew with them, but I understand completely and concur. Some of those guys were crazy.
That withstanding, many of them had nerves of steel . . . not to mention other parts of the body which were of bronze and brass.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:51 pm
by Wm.Ince
Jim Hardin wrote:Professional Flying is the key there Bill :wink:
I have given check outs & Flight Reviews to many pilots who left me scratching my head. Nothing I could/would bust them on but very mediocre skills and knowledge. I gave them some firm suggestions but there is only so much.
Concur.
Though they met standards, I could not help but wonder, if I would be reading about them at some point . . . or perhaps, a particular safety procedure was going to be named after them.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:54 pm
by Wm.Ince
TimTaylor wrote:I don't know the statistics, but I think driving a car is much more dangerous than flying an airplane. There's a lot more to hit and a lot more idiots on the road.
Absolutely correct.
The statistics are out there to prove it beyond any doubt. It's not even close.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:17 pm
by TimTaylor
Speaking of flight safety, we had a fatal plane crash today near Gainesville, GA. Plane belonged to Flight School Of Gwinnett. Three occupants, one killed.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:15 pm
by TimTaylor
TimTaylor wrote:Speaking of flight safety, we had a fatal plane crash today near Gainesville, GA. Plane belonged to Flight School Of Gwinnett. Three occupants, one killed.
Unfortunately, I may have seen that plane fly over late this afternoon while I was walking my dog. I saw a plane that looked like it was headed up GA 400 and I wondered if it was headed to Gainesville. That would have been a likely flight path from KLZU to KGVL. It crashed just a couple miles from my friend's lake house on Lake Lanier. Looks like he was making an emergency landing on GA 369 and hit some power lines and a car. I'm thinking maybe they made a touch-and-go at KGVL and were headed back to KGVL when they had engine failure. Or, maybe they never made it to KGVL. It was a Piper Arrow.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:27 am
by Delta Echo
definately more safe, than driving a car.
I think, aviation accidents are actially rare, thats why is a big deal when there is one, and everywhere in the news.
They dont put all car crashes into the news...
But have you read some statistics?

And, as I ve learned.... if you cut edges, skip some steps (like from the checlist etc), there is 3 or 4 or more small mistakes and conditions roll into a huge accident....
Like, pilot is tired having hangover? - risk. Skip one step from checklist, and for example, dlaps stuck in 10 degrees - risk. Pilot is stressed, loosing orientation? - risk. Pilot is switching to a wrong frequency due to stress? - risk. All can be solved, but if you f.... up many things all together, then flying is not safe.
Otherwise, it is.
:)

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:17 am
by MrMorden
Delta Echo wrote:definately more safe, than driving a car.
I think, aviation accidents are actially rare, thats why is a big deal when there is one, and everywhere in the news.
They dont put all car crashes into the news...
But have you read some statistics?
Statistically from my research, in terms of fatalities per hour engaged in the activity, general aviation comes down as more dangerous than driving a car and less dangerous than riding motorcycles.

As I mentioned previously in this thread, that does not tell the whole story though, since the vast majority of aviation's accidents are preventable and most risk factors well within the pilot's control. A very lax pilot will be in far greater danger than when driving, a very safety-conscious pilot using good judgment will be far more safe than a driver on the road.

In driving, about half of fatalities are self-inflicted. In aviation the number is 90% or more.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:00 pm
by drseti
MrMorden wrote: Statistically from my research, in terms of fatalities per hour engaged in the activity, general aviation comes down as more dangerous than driving a car and less dangerous than riding motorcycles.
That's true, in terms of fatalities per hour of exposure. The NTSB's standard safety metric is fatalities per 100,000 mi. Given the relative speed advantage of airplanes vs. cars and motorcycles, this skews the statistic, making GA safer than driving.

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:15 pm
by drseti
In fact, given that standard NTSB metric, the safest transportation mode, by a wide margin, is spaceflight! (True even taking into account Apollo 1, Challenger, and Columbia.)

Re: How safe is flying?

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 4:08 pm
by FastEddieB
Warmi wrote:Flying is very unforgiving in a way that driving or frankly many other activities are not.
MrMorden wrote:A very lax pilot will be in far greater danger than when driving, a very safety-conscious pilot using good judgment will be far more safe than a driver on the road.

In driving, about half of fatalities are self-inflicted. In aviation the number is 90% or more.
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