Aiming for your touch down point

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Moderator: drseti

3Dreaming
Posts: 3107
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:13 pm
Location: noble, IL USA

Re: Aiming for your touch down point

Post by 3Dreaming »

You guys need to remember he is flying a high drag single seat ultralight, and not your normal light aircraft.
Merlinspop
Posts: 999
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:48 pm
Location: WV Eastern Panhandle

Re: Aiming for your touch down point

Post by Merlinspop »

3Dreaming wrote:You guys need to remember he is flying a high drag single seat ultralight, and not your normal light aircraft.
There's a bit of information that might have been useful earlier in the discussion. :D
- Bruce
CTLSi
Posts: 783
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:38 pm

Re: Aiming for your touch down point

Post by CTLSi »

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Last edited by CTLSi on Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
rezaf_2000
Posts: 106
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:33 pm
Location: Champaign, IL

Re: Aiming for your touch down point

Post by rezaf_2000 »

drseti wrote:
Torque wrote:On an engine out I am carrying extra energy to make sure I can do my flare and not stall her at this point.
I understand technique varies from one aircraft to the next, Tony, and I certainly respect your right to choose what works for you -- but this is most definitely not what I teach my primary students. In my teaching style, it's all about wanting to stall in the flare -- just inches above the runway. In fact, when we practice power-off stalls, it is for the purpose of learning proper full-stall landing technique. The practice maneuver starts in a power-off glide (at a safe altitude), in landing configuration and at normal approach speed, while lined up with a road, field, or some other imaginary runway. The runway is assumed to be at a specified altitude (typically a couple of thousand feet AGL). Up to that point, airspeed must be held constant. As that "runway" altitude is approached, the student applies back-pressure to start a gentle round-out (the flare), ignoring airspeed and bringing the plane level (so no further altitude is lost), and then increasing back pressure to bring the nose up to a specified pitch angle (the landing attitude) as the airspeed decreases. Holding the plane nose high at a constant altitude (just as you would do directly over the runway), critical angle of attack is exceeded, and the plane begins to buffet. This is the stall, at which point (in an actual landing) runway contact occurs. Since there is no runway directly under the wheels, the maneuver continues with a stall recovery, which is just a go-around. You relax back-pressure slightly to achieve normal climb-out attitude, while smoothly adding full power and just enough rudder pressure to overcome engine torque, and continue to hold runway heading. Then, climb out as you normally would, having just converted a landing to a takeoff. (Call it a touch-and-go without the touch.)

I admit that this is not the way stalls are normally taught, because the objective is usually stated as "to do stalls", rather than "to learn how to land." As a consequence (and maybe because every student has heard of the dreaded stall/spin accident), most students don't enjoy stalls, think they're something to avoid at all cost, and insist that the best way to avoid a spin is never stall the airplane.

Since a stall is simply a loss of lift from the wing, and since this is required in order to land, those students who say they'll never do a stall are still up there...
On a normal landing its about pitch and power management.
Again, if that works for you, fine -- but in my curriculum it's all about airspeed and energy management. If landings required power management, glider pilots would be in big trouble!
How you manage your power is up to you. I use pitch and throttle.
Actually, Tony, you do indeed use throttle to control power. But as I see it, pitch in no way controls power -- it controls airspeed.
Thank you Dr. Shuch, I was trying to remember and visualize the landings from the last weekend with my instructor before my next classes tomorrow, and your description is perfect. I appreciate your thoroughness.
200 hours of flight and counting
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