looking for advice on picking flight school or instructor

[Bani]

hi i m a new member to sport pilot talk and i m looking to start my training towards a sport pilot certificate in the next couple of weeks in the Tampa bay area and i was looking for some advice on what to look for in a potential flight schools or instructor. Also if anybody knows of a good flight school or instructor in the area that offers instruction towards the sport pilot license.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks

[Jack Tyler]

Bani, good topic! I'm sure you'll get a variety of comments and they will come from a variety of sources (current and recently licensed students, instructors and other pilots including those with PP licenses rather than SPLs, like me). Here are a couple of suggestions based on my training experience as a student pilot and instrument student while flying out of KSPG, Albert Whitted Airport, and located within the Tampa Bay region.

-- First, a general suggestion: Join AOPA (aopa.org), which is free for 6 months to student pilots (https://flighttraining.aopa.org/apps/st ... ty=SX12LFT), subscribe to their Flight Training magazine (it's excellent and directed specifically at you), and do a bit of digging on the portion of their extensive website that deals with selecting an instructor and flight training program (one place to start might be here: http://www.aopa.org/letsgoflying/ready/). Because of the abysmal completion rates of student pilots (~20% of those starting training become licensed, and the attrition continues in the first year after a license is earned), AOPA recently did extensive research on what led to success in flight training. That info is also available on their website, and they've folded some of what they learned into this $3 pub, which you might consider purchasing (this is the .pdf version): http://shop.aopa.org/view_cart.asp?catid= (I realize that you may be eager to get started and here I'm throwing lots of 'research' at you...but make no mistake, two of the most influential decisions you make - choosing a school and choosing an instructor - are made when you know the least. So the research is not just an antidote to becoming part of the 80% who don't earn a license, it also helps insure a fulfilling and rewarding training experience).
-- Consider how far (in minutes or miles) you are willing to drive for your training, and then using a sectional chart (or skyvector.com) identify all the airfields that you would consider viable as training locations. In the Tampa Bay area, that's a LOT of fields if you're willing to commute 30-40 mins each way. Keep in mind that driving a car is a lot less expensive than flying a plane, and so a more remote training location might end up be better for you if e.g. they have multiple LSA training aircraft or a lower per hour rental rate or they have self-service fuel (or better yet, mogas) on the field. You can do a lot of initial shopping via the phone, asking some basic questions and eliminating some of the airfields before you hop in the car to meet folks.
-- Consider traffic pattern density and airspace density before choosing a field. You wouldn't consider basing yourself at Tampa Bay International Airport (even if they offered flight training)...but you might consider St. Pete/Clearwater International (KPIE) because they have multiple training programs there. It's the home of the largest USCG airbase, some commercial & charter operations, and significant General Aviation activity, so for a beginner it can be a bit overwhelming. (Once you build skills, you can easily learn how to operate in a busy Class D airspace like that...but as a beginning student, it may not be the best location even if it offers a good training program). By contrast, Albert Whitted is a healthy, fairly busy GA airport but it offers lots of training space to the west and east, and its operating tower will require you to master aviation communications - so a good mix of challenges with ease of operation. (However, it's never been a place with relatively inexpensive training or fuel). If you go east of Tampa, you'll find a highly regarded LSA/SP training facility at Plant City. No tower, multiple LSA training a/c, and a very active SPL community. So there's lot of variables to weigh.
- finally, try to make sure you have the financial resources available to you to complete your training before you begin, and that you have your personal commitments (work, family, community involvements) arranged in such a fashion that they won't seriously cripple a regular training program. The best progress comes from sticking with a regular program (one or two sessions each week, week after week). In your area, you enjoy great weather that will almost never interfere with a training regimen. You need to bring the same level of predictability to the effort as Mother Nature.

Good luck to you and keep us posted on where you decide to train and how the training progresses. It will be helpful info to others here.

[jnmeade]

The more often you can fly, the faster you learn, is my experience when I did a lot of primary instruction, and is pretty universally support by the aviation instructor community. It's like you decided to learn to shoot free throws. The more often you do it, the better you become and the sooner. Once a week is a bare minimum. Depending on weather, airplane and instructor availability and other factors, you may end up scheduling three times a week to fly twice.

Have your finances ready up front so you don't end up having to take a hiatus from instruction.

There are all kinds of instructors - the old, gruff military type, the greenhorn time builder, the part time guy looking for free flight time, etc. Even a few who genuinely instruct for their satisfaction. See if you can find one who's teaching style matches your personality and learning style. For example, you might prefer one who gives you all the theory or you might like one who is pretty much hands on. Communication is key. All things considered, I prefer a seasoned instructor who has "been around", with instruction experience and some charter time flying in all kinds of weather in many kinds of airspace.

There is so much to learn at first that the "instructor as god" syndrome is easy to catch. Especially with new instructors but also with old "in the rut" instructors, you may get a lot of "do this" or "believe this" without as much factual basis as you'd like. You want an instructor you are confident is current on regs, knows the airplane well and isn't afraid to look something up.

Some instructors will turn you loose on your ground school, some will recommend some materials, and some will want to do all the ground school. Whatever you do, keep in mind the FAA study materials are free and I think very good.

Your instructor should have some kind of syllabus and you should know pretty much all the time what you are doing and what comes next. As a minimum, keep in mind you have to accomplish the requirements of the PTS, also available free on the FAA web site. If there is any doubt about what or how well you need to do something, the PTS should be the base line.

Try to find an environment that is welcoming. Some are not, others are. It's more fun to hangar fly with people who don't look down their nose if you haven't flown 50 missions over Berlin, but don't expect everyone to share and endorse your own personal enthusiasms and interests. Having said that, it's important that you have friends and supporters who like aviation.

[drseti]

The more often you can fly, the faster you learn, is my experience

Well, yes, up to a point. But in my experience, there's a point of diminishing returns, where the student starts to saturate, burn out, and experience an actual dimunition of skills.

. Once a week is a bare minimum.

Agreed. And IMHO, three times a week is a reasonable maximum. There are intensive programs that have you fly once or twice a day, every day, and claim to get you licensed in a week or two. They're called crash courses for a reason!

Have your finances ready up front so you don't end up having to take a hiatus from instruction.

Finances lined up - absolutely. But, a well positioned hiatus can be advantageous. I recommend that my students take a short break after the first solo. They've been working hard for a few weeks to achieve that milestone, and are ready to take some time to decompress. With a two week break from flying, they can do the required self-study to come up to speed on the knowledge test. Once they've gotten that hurdle out of the way, they're ready to jump right into their post-solo training.

. See if you can find one who's teaching style matches your personality and learning style.

Or even better, one who can help you to identify your learning style, and adjust his or her teaching style to best meet your personal needs.

Your instructor should have some kind of syllabus and you should know pretty much all the time what you are doing and what comes next.

That's absolutely essential. There's nothing as frustrating as arriving for a lesson, and having the CFI ask, "now, let's see,what did we do last time? What do you want to do today?"

it's important that you have friends and supporters who like aviation.

This is where flying clubs pay dividends. Lacking a club, look for a flight school that projects the flying club type of environment.

Good luck, and happy flying!

[David]

My suggestion move to the great state of PA and get get your training from Paul. If a move is out of the equation, just have him give you an accelerated sport pilot course.

Good luck on finding a good instructor

[AustrianGuy]

I'm definitely to "green" to give you advice, but that's how I did it.

1) geographic location. If the place is too far away it reduces the probability to be able to schedule a lesson (time, inconvenience, cost of driving)
2) availability of the airplane. I picked a small operation that has 2 airplanes in my category
3) Meet the people and just feel the "vibe". I usually get along with people easy but there is always the exception, if you get my meaning.
4) Discovery flight to see how that works for real.

Find your balance between spending time/effort to decide which one and over analyzing and never get started. As much as I personally hate it ... nothing is perfect, everything is a compromise.

Just my $0.02

Christoph

[langj]

I liked trying out different instructors to find the right match. I went up with two other instructors before I knew I had the best one for me Paul Hamilton. I learned real quick to look to see what the goals of the instructor are. Are they there to get time for them to fly or are they interested in helping you. Too, many instructors I have been with like to take over and say "hey check this out" the problem is their bored and want you to pay for them to perform unsafe stupid stunts for their entertainment. Now, I am not saying to not let your instructor show you how to correctly do something just not do stunts in the airplane for entertainment. Safety was the most important thing for me in choosing the correct instructor. An instructor who is a teacher and safe is much better then a know it all who thinks he is Maverick from Top Gun.

Also, don't plan on just using an instructor to get your license. I take one up with me every once in awhile since getting my license to practice and fine tune my flying.

[drseti]

Paul H is certainly one of the best out there. I'd say you lucked out in getting to work with him.

[newamiga]

One suggestion based on my experience is to seek out a flight school where sport pilots are encouraged and they have more than one LSA if possible. The first part is that many schools you go to seem really focused on private pilot training and will try to convince you to go the PPL route. A school that is totally bought into light sport training is just better in my opinion. I learned in one in Denver that specialized in light sport training and had multiple aircraft. The second part is important to me. Things happen with planes in flight schools. If you are hot and heavy in training and the plane gets taken off the line for an extended period it can really slow you down.

I was also lucky that the school I went to had a variety of LSA's and even multiple models of the same plane so I got to try differing avionics to see what I liked best. Not sure if you like analog or digital instruments, but for me I found digital much easier to use. Again this is a personal preference and different people will learn differently.

Carl

[Jack Tyler]

"...seek out a flight school where...they have more than one LSA if possible."

Absolutely. Case in point: Brand new C162 arrived at a local, very successfully run flight school here. Open house, lots of demo flights, some SP candidates appear out of the woodwork from all over Jacksonville, then a student forgets to engage the secondary door lock and Zipppppp! the door opens & is broken. A call to Cessna orders the new door, Cessna calls the Chinese factory, order goes in the queue, door is then shipped to KS - by ship, no less, since that ends up being far cheaper - after which Cessna has to inspect and ship. Many weeks of no SP training AND a genuine loss of momentum for both the school and its fledgling efforts to start a SP Flying Club.

[FrankR]

Bani,

I know there is a school with a Skycatcher for rent at Clearwater Airpark (KCLW) in Clearwater.

I believe there is also training and rental available at Peter O. Knight Airport (KTPF) in Tampa although I don't remeber what they have.

I also believe there are also LSA operations at Plant City (KPCM) and Tampa North (X39).

[drseti]

seek out a flight school where... they have more than one LSA if possible.

Full disclosure notice: I run a small, one-airplane flight school, so my opinion here is probably not totally objective.

In many cases, the very best instructional experience will be to fly with a dedicated, experienced flight instructor, who takes on one student at a time (maximizing individual attention) in his or her own (or the flight instructor's own) aircraft. Probably an older guy or gal, retired and teaching for the love of it. This is a completely different learning experience than what can be gained studying at a large flight school, with a flight line full of aircraft and a stable full of CFIs aspiring to become airline captains, any one of which (airplane or instructor) may be assigned to you for a given lesson. The large or the small flight school may work better for you, given your personal learning style. But if you go the small school route, the aircraft options will probably be limited.

So, what is the advantage of the one-airplane, one-instructor approach? You become an apprentice, learning at the foot of the master, rather than just another student. If it's a good fit (and it doesn't always work out that way), you might develop a close personal relationship with your instructor, which can last a lifetime. Especially if the CFI instructs in and also maintains his or her own plane, you will get to work on the plane alongside the CFI/mechanic whenever it goes down. So, you'll be getting training not just to be a pilot, but to be a knowledgeable aircraft owner some day. And, if you're the only student, the plane won't go down as often as you think, unless you do something wrong (and that, too, is a valuable learning experience).

If your goal is to get your license as quickly as possible, at the lowest possible cost, go to an assembly line type pilot factory, with lots of planes, lots of instructors, and maybe a simulator or two. If you want to be the best and safest possible pilot, find a master whom you respect, and work closely with him or her, for as long as it takes to learn as much as you can. In other words, fly with Mr. Miyagi.

Here we have yet another example of a basic truism in aviation: one size does not fit all.

Addendum: Sometimes, that close, personal relationship with a flight instructor lasts beyond a lifetime. See, for example, my Avalon Eden stories:

http://avsport.org/publicat/index.html#avalon

[jnmeade]

It's all about eachs, isn't it?
One sister, married to a pilot, started her PPL training and got about to solo. Flying with the typical young CFI who didn't understand all he knew. She's been inactive for a couple of years.
Another sister, married to a pilot, started her PPL and got about to solo. Flying with an older, very experienced CFI who teaches procedures but not reasons. She's been inactive for a couple of years.
Both are frustrated and not quite "angry" but irritated at their experience. They are in late middle age. Both are smart, successful women who are accomplished in their field. I'm too far away and besides, I let my medical lapse so I can't really "finish them up" or I would.
I see a local example of the retired man who is now a CFI. That individual is not a credit to the profession. He is not incompetent, but just hasn't been around the block. I say that the CFI with experience flying charter is the guy you want. He not only knows how to do things, but he knows WHY you do them and how they fit in the system, the big picture.
The old guy that Paul described is indeed what you want - so long as he'd hauled a few loads of checks, chicks or even people in weather that is not so hot into airports that are too busy or too isolated.

[drseti]

The old guy that Paul described is indeed what you want - so long as he'd hauled a few loads of checks, chicks or even people in weather that is not so hot into airports that are too busy or too isolated.

Jim's right. That's the instructor you want, if you're lucky enough to find him or her. Avalon Eden, in my fictional accounts referenced earlier, is actually a composite of two such instructors. They were active between three and five decades back, but I'm sure such women (and men) still exist. It's just a challenge to locate them.

[Jack Tyler]

First, I see lots of useful advice to Bani being posted but no replies/follow-ups/comments from Bani. Still around? Thoughts? A thank you or two, where you found replies to be helpful? Helloooo...

Second, I'm doing a Flight Review next week with just the sort of 'older person' described above. USAF pilot for 24 yrs, then Corp. pilot for oil drilling outfit, flew banners at our local airport just for fun, etc. He has instructed for many years, and is still an active CFII in his 80's. To Paul's point he has become a close personal friend to each member of our family and even gave the oath to our son at his commissioning. BUT realistically, this kind of person is very hard to find. As a rule, flight schools no longer allow adjunct instructors; they have too little student traffic and have to save those students for their regular instructors. Instructing in one's own plane, infrequently and on an 'as needed basis', isn't comparable to Paul's operation and is not financially feasible. And then there are the simple demographics that have removed many (tho' certainly not all) experienced instructors from the flying ranks during the past 2-3 decades. My point is that such an individual might be as hard to find as s/he sounds good.

Third, I'd just like to point out that Paul describes two ends of a wide continuum. There are many choices inbetween the single a/c-single instructor operation and Paul's "large flight school, with a flight line full of aircraft and a stable full of CFIs aspiring to become airline captains." (In the Sport Pilot world, there are very few of those schools). To pick a training business that can offer only a single training a/c is to - literally - put all one's training eggs in a single basket. As my description of the Skycatcher with the missing door illustrated. This doesn't disqualify the single a/c-single instructor choice, and there can be clear offsetting benefits - e.g. the fact that Paul is actually an educator by profession and became an instructor by passion. But let's not overlook the realities of the one-man band.