Can I fly a single seat with a student pilots license.

[Lspilot82]

I'm thinking about buying a little single seat, something relatively cheap that I can use to build time in. I have a few grand saved and am scouring the internet as we speak looking for something. My question is since I only have a student certificate, can I get a endorsement from a instructor to fly the plane. Also, same question for my practical. Can a examiner observe me from the ground and test me that way. Just asking. Thanks.

[FrankR]

I don't know about pre-solo or solo-student flight but I know you can do your check ride.

I'm sure once you are signed off for solo, I'm sure there's a way to fly legally. But how do you get to that point? CFI's?

From: The PTS http://www.faa.gov/training_testing/tes ... 081-29.pdf

FAA-S-8081-29
SPORT PILOT
Practical Test Standards
for
• Airplane
• Gyroplane
• Glider
• Flight Instructor

Page 9:

Single-Seat Aircraft Practical Test

Applicants for a Sport Pilot Certificate may elect to take their test in a single-seat aircraft. The FAA established in 14 CFR part 61, section 61.45(f) specific requirements to allow a practical test for a Sport Pilot Certificate only. This provision does not allow a practical test for a Flight Instructor Certificate or Recreation Pilot Certificate or higher to be conducted in a light-sport aircraft that has a single-pilot seat.

It goes on quite a bit. There are rules. Read them.

As a student, get a copy of the PTS. It costs about $5. They are available from King, Gleim, Sporty's, etc.

I used mine to make up checklists for all of the maneuver requirments (feet, speed, etc) that would be required during my check ride.

[Recumbentrider]

Thanks for asking this. I last was able to fly a light sport aircraft in early August. Since the aircraft has yet to be replaced, I've thought about this as an option.

The question I need answered is how to get endorsed to fly the aforementioned single seater since dual in it isn't an option. I had almost nine hours of solo time before aircraft availability took me out of the air. Now it will be start over in the spring from the looks since work, weather, and short days restricts quality flight time.

[drseti]

As a student, get a copy of the PTS. It costs about $5.

Free on my website.

[cornfieldflyer]

I'm thinking about buying a little single seat, something relatively cheap that I can use to build time in. I have a few grand saved and am scouring the internet as we speak looking for something. My question is since I only have a student certificate, can I get a endorsement from a instructor to fly the plane. Also, same question for my practical. Can a examiner observe me from the ground and test me that way. Just asking. Thanks.

Yes you can do your training in a single seater. The cfi stands on the ground within radio contact with you. You get to fly your single seater for 5 years under this student certificate.

This is all written in the regs for sp. Get yourself a copy of the SP book. Its published by ASA. Its called the ASA Sport Pilot Training manual or something like that. I have let a friend use mine. He kept having CFI's telling him how SP should be taught. I told him to show this book to the CFI's and do not let them try to rewrite this book.

Every CFI I have talked with in my area do not even know this book is out there. I asked every one if they have wread this book, not one had. But they wanted to rewrite it. I then showed them how this training is to be done in black and white. Everyone I spoke with said they would not do it that way.

I asked each one what gives them the right to rewrite this book. Lets just say I do not have a lot of friends in my area becuase of this. I have been called a lot of names and reckless is one. How one folowing the rules is being reckless I have no idea. I have also been told that with my way of thinking I will not be around long.

I said I am not doing anything reckelss. Each CFI said they will never train the way its written in the sport pilot book. I told them I do not want them trianing me. They said good they do not want to train me.

GA CFI"s are lost when it comes to SP. They have never heard of a CFI standing on the ground with a radio. Everyone said its not safe. I just shook my head and walked away from each one. They are not informed and myself I like informed people. I see most CFI's believe they "know it all"

I do not want to fly with a "Know It all" or be trained by one.

You can fly your bird for 5 years under the Student SP certificate. When I went to OshKosh and received my Student Certificate the CFI told me this.
1. CFI's will try and rush you to finish this certificate, take 5 years if you need it, we give you 5 years use every year.
2. You can fly your single seater under Stundent SP. You must stay within 50 miles of your Home field 3IS5.
3. Do all training in my single seater but to do my checkride in a dual seat. Doing it this way allows me later to get a dual seater and not have an indorsement signed in my log book. You can do your check ride in a dual seater. But can do all your training in a single seater.

Tony

One does not have to have all the answer, just know where to find the answers.

[3Dreaming]

I'm thinking about buying a little single seat, something relatively cheap that I can use to build time in. I have a few grand saved and am scouring the internet as we speak looking for something. My question is since I only have a student certificate, can I get a endorsement from a instructor to fly the plane. Also, same question for my practical. Can a examiner observe me from the ground and test me that way. Just asking. Thanks.

Yes you can do your training in a single seater. The cfi stands on the ground within radio contact with you. You get to fly your single seater for 5 years under this student certificate.

This is all written in the regs for sp. Get yourself a copy of the SP book. Its published by ASA. Its called the ASA Sport Pilot Training manual or something like that. I have let a friend use mine. He kept having CFI's telling him how SP should be taught. I told him to show this book to the CFI's and do not let them try to rewrite this book.

Every CFI I have talked with in my area do not even know this book is out there. I asked every one if they have wread this book, not one had. But they wanted to rewrite it. I then showed them how this training is to be done in black and white. Everyone I spoke with said they would not do it that way.

I asked each one what gives them the right to rewrite this book. Lets just say I do not have a lot of friends in my area becuase of this. I have been called a lot of names and reckless is one. How one folowing the rules is being reckless I have no idea. I have also been told that with my way of thinking I will not be around long.

I said I am not doing anything reckelss. Each CFI said they will never train the way its written in the sport pilot book. I told them I do not want them trianing me. They said good they do not want to train me.

GA CFI"s are lost when it comes to SP. They have never heard of a CFI standing on the ground with a radio. Everyone said its not safe. I just shook my head and walked away from each one. They are not informed and myself I like informed people. I see most CFI's believe they "know it all"

I do not want to fly with a "Know It all" or be trained by one.

You can fly your bird for 5 years under the Student SP certificate. When I went to OshKosh and received my Student Certificate the CFI told me this.
1. CFI's will try and rush you to finish this certificate, take 5 years if you need it, we give you 5 years use every year.
2. You can fly your single seater under Stundent SP. You must stay within 50 miles of your Home field 3IS5.
3. Do all training in my single seater but to do my checkride in a dual seat. Doing it this way allows me later to get a dual seater and not have an indorsement signed in my log book. You can do your check ride in a dual seater. But can do all your training in a single seater.

Tony

One does not have to have all the answer, just know where to find the answers.

Tony, I have not read the book, but I would guess that it tells what needs to be taught, but not how to teach it. You can not do all your training in a single seater. You must meet the training requirements of 61.87 a, b, c, and d for a single engine airplane. The flight training required by this must be done in a two place aircraft (it doesn't have to be a light sport aircraft).

If your instructor is OK with endorsing your student pilot certificate for solo flight in a single seater then you can fly it legally, after you have had the training required by 61.87. You can do all of your solo time in the single place airplane. You can even do your check ride in the single place if you can find a DPE that is willing to do it.

While your student pilot certificate is good for 5 years you must also have an endorsement from an instructor for your make and model of aircraft before you can use it for solo flight. You must also have an additional endorsement every 90 days for continued solo flight.

61.93 says you can only fly 25 miles from where you take off and you can not land at any other airport, unless you have had the training and endorsement required by 61.93 b.

Tom

[cornfieldflyer]

Tom you need to read the book for it DOES tell the instructor Step by Step what is involved in the training. Its in Black and white.
You need to read this book. It written for just this purpose to educate those that want to be part of this program. To many want to work this program as they believe it should be and not how its written.....READ THE BOOK..how can anyone teach something they have not studied. Just because you are a GA CFI does not make you a SP CFI. I am sorry if I offend anyone but that is the way it is...like they say..it is what it is.....
Once you read this book get back to me and then tell me I am wrong.

I will never hear from you again.

Tony

[cornfieldflyer]

All training for SP can be done in a single seater from training to check ride.....READ the BOOK...Its states in black and white it can be done in a single seater with the CFI on the ground with a radio. The check ride. It can be done in a single seater.....READ THE BOOK then tell me I am wrong.....

Am I the only one on this site that has read this book? This was the first thing I did was read this book.

Tony

[FrankR]

Get yourself a copy of the SP book. Its published by ASA. Its called the ASA Sport Pilot Training manual or something like that.

I looked for that book. I googled it; went to the ASA website. No luck.

Can I get a link to it?

[drseti]

Tony, ASA is an excellent publisher, with some outstanding authors (including our own Paul Hamilton). They have some great books, and I do encourage students and instructors alike to read everything they can get their hands on.

That said, the only official sources of flight training requirements are the FARs and the PTS. Anything else is just the author's opinion. (i've written about a dozen books myself over the past 30 years, and they do NOT supersede the official FAA publications). Even FAA Advisory Circulars are just that -advisory, not regulatory.

In another post i'll cover what the FARs say about training and practical tests in a single seat aircraft. You need to know that the FARs have changed in recent years, so I will try to look up and post the current language.

[drseti]

Decades ago, when I started instructing, it was common practice to solo students (and even give flight reviews and practical tests) in single seat aircraft. We'd stand on the ground, watch the student perform specified maneuvers, and talk on the radio. Then, the rules were changed.

Now a student pilot can solo any aircraft with an appropriate logbook endorsement, within the previous 90 days, as long as the student abides by the limitations in that endorsement. Here's where the problem starts.

The regs say that the instructor's endorsement must say that he or she has given the student instruction in the same make and model of aircraft. It used to say category and class, but is now make and model specific. And, elsewhere in the FARs, it is written that "instruction" can only be given in an aircraft with full dual controls. What you can get in a single-seat aircraft is "training", not "instruction" as required for the endorsement. Ditto for simulator or approved training device - useful, but it doesn't meet the requirements for a solo endorsement.

Same problem with a flight review. The FARs used to specify those maneuvers which, at the discretion of the flight instructor, demonstrated competence to serve as PIC. No longer. Now, the regs say a flight review must include at least one hour of ground training and one hour of flight instruction. There's that word again - instruction, which requires dual controls. So, I can no longer give single-seat flight reviews.

Checkrides are a similar problem, for a different reason. Any flight test for the purpose of obtaining a rating or privilege counts as a flight review. But since flight reviews now require dual controls, it would seem that checkrides (that serve as a flight review) also do. That's not the answer we are all wanting to hear, but there you have it.

[drseti]

In this installment, I will talk about the flight instructor's responsibility.

Many CFIs (including me) have standards and requirements that exceed the FAR and PTS requirements. This is not because we want to give you a hard time, or cost you money, but rather because we carry a heavy burden. We are responsible for your safety, both during training and throughout your whole flying career.

When a student or former student is involved in an incident or accident, the FAA has the right to re-examine every instructor who has ever trained that pilot or given him or her a checkride or flight review. I know this to be true - it's happened to me. Since my rating is on the line, there can be no room for doubts.

But FAA and blame aside, when a former student is involved in a fatal accident (and, sadly, I have experienced this as well), the instructor agonizes over what he or she might have done differently. Did I give the pilot all necessary tools? Is there something I might have done differently, to prevent this tragedy? The questions and self-doubt haunt you, even decades later.

So, don't be too hard on the CFI who chooses not to instruct you in a single seat aircraft. It's only your life on the line, and we have to live with ourselves.

[cornfieldflyer]

In this installment, I will talk about the flight instructor's responsibility.

Many CFIs (including me) have standards and requirements that exceed the FAR and PTS requirements. This is not because we want to give you a hard time, or cost you money, but rather because we carry a heavy burden. We are responsible for your safety, both during training and throughout your whole flying career.

When a student or former student is involved in an incident or accident, the FAA has the right to re-examine every instructor who has ever trained that pilot or given him or her a checkride or flight review. I know this to be true - it's happened to me. Since my rating is on the line, there can be no room for doubts.

But FAA and blame aside, when a former student is involved in a fatal accident (and, sadly, I have experienced this as well), the instructor agonizes over what he or she might have done differently. Did I give the pilot all necessary tools? Is there something I might have done differently, to prevent this tragedy? The questions and self-doubt haunt you, even decades later.

So, don't be too hard on the CFI who chooses not to instruct you in a single seat aircraft. It's only your life on the line, and we have to live with ourselves.

I wish someone would read this book then explain to me how the FAA can come up with Regs for a program and everyone saying its not safe.

I am not being hard on CFI's. I just do not understand how this ASA Book came to be if no one wants to follow it. Please someone read this book and explain this to me.

I had to give this book to a friend because he just flat out told me I had no idea what I was talking about. I just last night spoke with him and he said I was right on with everything I said. Here is his quote to me. Quote..Its all right there in black and white, everything you speak of about training was right on. You where right and I was wrong....DA.. I knew this for I READ THE BOOK.

Please everyone read this book then respond back with an answer. From the remarks on this site every one of you are in for a " shock, or eye opener " once you read this book.

Please someone read this book. It was written for the Instructor and Sport Pilot to follow so both know what is expected of them during this training.

I will get my book back today and start posting some of what is written in that book word for word...

Tony

[cornfieldflyer]

Training......How this amazes me.....Everyone of us knows what it takes to get your drivers license...We go to a Goverment run facility, take tests then wait for an instructor to take us on a drive or Check ride in the aviation world. These instructors are trained in what they do. If any changes come to the drivers license they " the instructors " go back in for more training.

Now lets talk aviation. One goes and gets his pilot certificate then goes a little further and now becomes an " instructor " auto world" CFI " avaition " and starts training people. If any changes come to aviation these CFI's do not go in for more training, the organization whom they train for does not have any checks or balances in place to make sure these CFI, instructors get any more training after that certificate is given to them.

Now I am assuming all this, but from what I have seen this is the way it must be. I have not seen or talked with one SP CFI who has had any training in the training of SP.

What I found is this, they " instructors, cfi's what have you" have found out or became informed as to what equipment is needed for SP. After finding this info out now they start training SP. Why not, for these CFI's are already qualified to train GA why are they not qualified to teach SP.

Please someone tell me I am wrong. I would love to hear from one SP CFI who went in for or study for thier SP instructor or Sport Pilot CFI training.....I do not want to hear from a GA CFI who just " Knows it all ". I do not like " Know It All's"

All I am asking, I want to hear from a SP CFI who read a book on how to train SP. Not just what equipment was involved.

Tony

[drseti]

You are totally mistaken, Tony. Every CFI is required by the FARs to renew his or her flight instructor certificate every two years. This involves a two to three day refresher course. Changes in the FARs are indeed covered, including the Sport Pilot rules. A CFI must pass a written exam after this course. Those who claim not to know the Sport Pilot rules were either sleeping in class, or just don't want to train Sport Pilots for whatever reason.

CFIs are also required to take TSA security training once per year, and get a logbook endorsement upon completion of this training.

Most responsible CFIs also do a phase of the FAA Safety Team Wings training once per year. And those of us who are FAASTeam Representitives conduct safety seminars for other pilots, and instructors, several times per year. My own seminars tend to emphasize Sport Pilot rules and training procedures, tied to the FARs and PTS, so there's no excuse for instructors not to know the information. These seminars are free, and I give them all over the country (as do many others).

In addition, my flight school gets audited three times a year: by FAA, TSA, and the State Division of Aeronautics. This industry is very well controlled.

Don't assume, Tony. Ask!