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Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:36 pm
by MrMorden
According to the following data, KCAS is 46kt at 40kt KIAS and 53kt at 50KIAS with flaps up. Above that the numbers between KIAS and KCAS are the same or KCAS is lower. The crossover point seems to be about 60kt.

https://axenty.com/resources/APD/Cessna%20152%20PD.pdf

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:57 pm
by TimTaylor
Whatever the numbers are, it only seems logical that any change to the LSA specifications would encompass the Cessna 150/152 specifications, IMHO.

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:17 pm
by MrMorden
TimTaylor wrote:Whatever the numbers are, it only seems logical that any change to the LSA specifications would encompass the Cessna 150/152 specifications, IMHO.


Agreed. That was my point.

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:18 pm
by drseti
MrMorden wrote:The crossover point seems to be about 60kt.


That's pretty typical. The crossover point is generally at L/D Max (the inflection point on the total drag curve). Below that speed constitutes the area of reverse command, also known as "behind the power curve." That inflection point is also generally best glide speed, and optimum landing approach speed for an LSA.

It is important to note that the LSA stall speed limit (45 kts) is below the crossover speed, and the rule refers specifically to clean calibrated stall speed. Therefore, those who say (for example) that a Cessna 152 meets the LSA stall speed restriction are mistaken, since they base that assertion upon indicated stall speed.

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:44 pm
by TimTaylor
MrMorden wrote:
TimTaylor wrote:Whatever the numbers are, it only seems logical that any change to the LSA specifications would encompass the Cessna 150/152 specifications, IMHO.


Agreed. That was my point.

And any pilot that can't safely fly a Cessna 150/152 probably should not be flying anything.

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:38 pm
by Cub flyer
Vashon keeps talking about how the airplane was designed to be used on floats. But with the short fat wing and 100hp how will it work out?

100hp in a J-3 on Aqua 1500s is pretty good performer but the Vashon is heavier gross and wider fuselage. J-3 with that setup sadly has very little useful load even no electric.

Vashon 135sq ft wing 9.7 lb sq ft @ 1320 wheels 10.51 lb sq ft @ 1420 floats
Piper J-3 178.5 sq ft wing 7.39 lb sq ft @ 1320 gross on floats

Or Cessna 150 at 160 sq ft wing. 10 lb sq ft @ 1600 with very effective flaps

I just don’t think it will work out with only 100hp unless they add some wing on floats. Yes the Vashon power loading is significantly better than the 150 at 280lbs less gross weight on wheels. Will it be enough to make acceptable climb?

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:09 pm
by TimTaylor
100 HP is plenty for 1430 max gross weight IMHO.

Re: Piper 100 vs Vashon Ranger

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:59 pm
by Cub flyer
Hopefully so. I liked a lot of the other ideas they have.