Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

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HAPPYDAN
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Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby HAPPYDAN » Tue Mar 17, 2015 11:57 am

I would like to ask someone familiar with the Cessna 162 Skycatcher to explain the use of the brakes/rudder pedals configuration and operation. My size 10's seem to have a problem discerning the difference between "brakes" and "rudder". And please don't assume anything. This is the only plane I have ever flown, and then only very little, and I can't seem to figure out the proper use. Thanks!

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drseti
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby drseti » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:14 pm

Try wearing the lightest shoes possible (sneakers or moccasins) so you can develop a feel for the pedals. With heavy shoes or boots, you get no tactile feedback. Also, when not wamting to drag the brakes (such as during takeoff or landing), make sure your heels are on the floor, with only your toes on the pedals.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof. H. Paul Shuch, Ph.D., CFII, LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC, iRMT
AvSport of Lock Haven
fly@AvSport.org
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SportPilot
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby SportPilot » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:27 pm

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Last edited by SportPilot on Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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drseti
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby drseti » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:34 pm

While you do indeed need to use differential braking to taxi (in all panes with castering nosewheels), you very mch need to avoid dragging brakes while on the runway. Hence, my comment about heels on the floor (once lined up, of course).
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof. H. Paul Shuch, Ph.D., CFII, LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC, iRMT
AvSport of Lock Haven
fly@AvSport.org
http://AvSport.org
http://facebook.com/SportFlying

stevem
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby stevem » Wed Mar 18, 2015 10:01 pm

I own a Skycatcher, and operating it on the ground was the most difficult skill to acquire in transitioning to the airplane. It takes some time to develop a feel for ground operation. After that the skill becomes natural and you no longer have to think about it. I strongly agree with wearing light shoes and keeping the heels on the floor. I operate the pedal/rudder by pushing with my lower legs with my heel in contact with the bottom of the pedal. I operate the brakes by extending my foot via the ankle and pushing the top of the pedal with my toes while keeping my lower leg still. I only have to briefly tap the brakes a few times at low speeds to go in the desired direction. Learning to use quick brake taps instead of pushing on the brake is what improved my taxi skills. In the Skycatcher, the rudder begins to have authority starting at around 10 knots. By 15-20 knots I steer on the ground using only the rudder. I do taxi a little faster in the 162 compared to my old 182. During takeoff and taxing it is important to not drag the brakes. Hope this helps

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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby HAPPYDAN » Thu Mar 19, 2015 10:08 am

stevem wrote:I own a Skycatcher, and operating it on the ground was the most difficult skill to acquire in transitioning to the airplane. It takes some time to develop a feel for ground operation. After that the skill becomes natural and you no longer have to think about it. I strongly agree with wearing light shoes and keeping the heels on the floor. I operate the pedal/rudder by pushing with my lower legs with my heel in contact with the bottom of the pedal. I operate the brakes by extending my foot via the ankle and pushing the top of the pedal with my toes while keeping my lower leg still. I only have to briefly tap the brakes a few times at low speeds to go in the desired direction. Learning to use quick brake taps instead of pushing on the brake is what improved my taxi skills. In the Skycatcher, the rudder begins to have authority starting at around 10 knots. By 15-20 knots I steer on the ground using only the rudder. I do taxi a little faster in the 162 compared to my old 182. During takeoff and taxing it is important to not drag the brakes. Hope this helps


Thanks, Stevem - that's what I need. I'll check that out on my next ride. As a former XC ski racer, I am can relate to Heel pressure vs Toe pressure. So if I read this right, work the rudders with heel pressure, and the brakes by articulating the ankle pressing with the toes? No wonder I've been slipping all my turns! I've been using the brakes! Ahhhh! CFI said "Step on the ball, watch the turn coordinator". I thought I was. :lol:

That said, I think the Skycatcher is a great little plane. I've seen a few for sale, some with autopilot. Maybe someday, when all this is behind me, I'll have a license plate frame that reads "My other car is a Skycatcher". :D

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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby SportPilot » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:00 pm

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Last edited by SportPilot on Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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drseti
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby drseti » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:13 pm

Get the license plate frame first, Dan, and the plane will follow. Richard Bach writes that if you hold an idea in your thoughts long enough, you will find a way to make it a reality.
As for where to place your feet, I agree with SportPilot.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof. H. Paul Shuch, Ph.D., CFII, LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC, iRMT
AvSport of Lock Haven
fly@AvSport.org
http://AvSport.org
http://facebook.com/SportFlying

HAPPYDAN
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby HAPPYDAN » Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:02 pm

drseti wrote:Get the license plate frame first, Dan, and the plane will follow. Richard Bach writes that if you hold an idea in your thoughts long enough, you will find a way to make it a reality.
As for where to place your feet, I agree with SportPilot.


:idea: Regarding placement of your feet, now I see your point. My thinking could inadvertently cause me to apply either brake at a most inopportune moment - like takeoff or touchdown in a crosswind. Ground loop, anyone?

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drdehave
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby drdehave » Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:48 pm

Keeping off the brakes was one of the hardest things for me to learn in the Sting Sport LSA (steerable nose wheel). It took me hundreds of hours to really master it. And like Paul says, the key was soft, supple shoes! Now, I keep those old $20 Walmart shoes at the hangar, and they go on before every single flight! They're no good for walking, so if I'll be doing that where I'm headed--or I'm going to stay overnight--my regular shoes go in the luggage box with me.

Before I "got it" my brake pads used to last 200-300 hours. Nowadays they never seem to wear out!
Sting Flight (Flying the Sting LSA)
http://www.youtube.com/user/9162069934/featured

HAPPYDAN
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby HAPPYDAN » Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:45 am

drdehave wrote:Keeping off the brakes was one of the hardest things for me to learn in the Sting Sport LSA (steerable nose wheel). It took me hundreds of hours to really master it. And like Paul says, the key was soft, supple shoes! Now, I keep those old $20 Walmart shoes at the hangar, and they go on before every single flight! They're no good for walking, so if I'll be doing that where I'm headed--or I'm going to stay overnight--my regular shoes go in the luggage box with me.

Before I "got it" my brake pads used to last 200-300 hours. Nowadays they never seem to wear out!


It was a Sting Sport plane I saw at a local private strip that piqued my interest in LSA. Then I watched a video of an Aussie dude that landed one with NO HANDS (on the controls)! I do hope to at least try one someday.

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FastEddieB
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby FastEddieB » Sat Mar 21, 2015 6:03 pm

My previous Traveler, Tiger and Cirrus and now my Sky Arrow all had/have free castering nose wheels.

In addition to what others have suggested, often taxiway "crown" can be your friend.

Most taxiways (and runways) have a slight hump or "crown" to them, to allow water to run off. Its subtle but its there.

How is that useful? Imagine taxiing and needing full left rudder plus an occasional stab of the left brake to keep the nose from going right. Try taxiing just left of the taxiway centerline. The plane will pull slightly more to the left as it tries to ride down the crown.

Again, the effect is subtle but definitely there. It will generally mean using just a tad less brake to keep from turning than it would on the centerline.

If this is new, try it and see if it helps!
Fast Eddie B.
Sky Arrow 600 E-LSA • N467SA
FastEddieB@mac.com

Danno
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby Danno » Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:35 am

I've got about 50 hours across 3 different 162s. I noticed that 1 was easy to control on the ground. One was difficult and one nearly impossible.
Some examination revealed that the nose gear became nearly impossible to pivot by hand with it lifted off the ground.
Once fixed it became fairly easy to steer. I use rudder with an occasional tap on the brake to get the turn initiated.

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drdehave
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby drdehave » Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:14 am

"Some examination revealed that the nose gear became nearly impossible to pivot by hand with it lifted off the ground."

Ah, yes, been there and done that! (i.e., bent the nose-gear strut) And that does definitely make ground-steering a challenge!
Sting Flight (Flying the Sting LSA)
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chavycha
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Re: Skycatcher Rudder Pedals

Postby chavycha » Thu May 28, 2015 5:08 pm

Shh... don't tell... but I fly the 162 with bare feet when I'm alone. :mrgreen:

Lightweight shoes do nicely when I have passengers.

Keep your heels on the floor and push with your legs, not toes, and you'll be fine.
Scott K. :: A bunch of silly letters
Disclaimer :: Listen to me at your own risk. These are just my opinions...


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