Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

This forum is for safety-related discussions. Be safe out there!

Moderator: drseti

User avatar
zaitcev
Posts: 633
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:38 pm
Location: Austin, TX
Contact:

Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by zaitcev »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0vXftdMFNg

This was going round on pilot forums. I know Eddie has seen it. Note that the instructor dies in the crash. Crash occured a few days ago.

I think the main safety lesson here is to stay on the centerline until climb rate is assured. The whole thing was precipitated by turning away from the runway. And if you crash, try to crash wings level.
User avatar
FastEddieB
Posts: 2880
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Lenoir City, TN/Mineral Bluff, GA

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by FastEddieB »

Just copying and pasting my first reply to the video on POA:

Scary.

The throttling back seems very, very counterintuitive.

I've been in that same situation numerous times as an instructor, and my reflex is full power, whatever right rudder it takes as the nose is aggressively lowered - even if ground contact is inevitable.

Several Cirrus's have come to grief in smoking holes to the left of the runway after botched go-arounds. I was the only thing that prevented one in an SR22 at Copperhill, TN. When surprised, pilots will often try to "steer" away from the left yaw with aileron, and are reluctant to lower the nose and stomp the rudder. Natural reflexes are all wrong when things go south like this.
Fast Eddie B.
Sky Arrow 600 E-LSA • N467SA
CFI, CFII, CFIME
[email protected]
User avatar
zaitcev
Posts: 633
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:38 pm
Location: Austin, TX
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by zaitcev »

We need to ask Paul about this as out ultimate expert in Evektor. However, I should note that when I came back to flying GX, I had to unlearn the rudder-stomping consciously. In particular when we went to do stalls, I found that rudder does very little when a wing drops in stall. In the same time, it was trivial to pick it up with aileron. Yes, in a stall! We did several so I could confirm. It's basically an airplane that rewards the "incorrect, naive" behaviour. I'm wondering if Evektor is like that too.
BrianL99
Posts: 314
Joined: Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:23 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by BrianL99 »

zaitcev wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0vXftdMFNg

This was going round on pilot forums. I know Eddie has seen it. Note that the instructor dies in the crash. Crash occured a few days ago.

I think the main safety lesson here is to stay on the centerline until climb rate is assured. The whole thing was precipitated by turning away from the runway. And if you crash, try to crash wings level.

Based on their track record, the other lesson is not to fly an Evektor.

http://flightdesign.com/files/Media/The ... idents.pdf
User avatar
drseti
Posts: 7227
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:42 pm
Location: Lock Haven PA
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by drseti »

zaitcev wrote:I'm wondering if Evektor is like that too.
No, Pete, the Evektor responds appropriately to rudder application with a low wing. Since this is counter-intuitive, let me explain how this works:

Say, a wing drops, with the angle of attack so high that the wing is near a stall (i.e., the ailerons are ineffective). Stomping rudder aggressively on the side away from the low wing causes the plane to yaw in the direction of the applied rudder. As the plane yaws, the low wing is accelerated, and the high one is slowed down. This causes more lift on the low wing, and less on the high one, which raises the low wing and lowers the high one.

Now, the only trick is to neutralize the rudders as soon as the wings come level. Otherwise, you've overcontrolled, the other wing drops, and you have to repeat the procedure in the opposite direction -- leading to the kind of dance with which most taildragger pilots are familiar on landing.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
User avatar
drseti
Posts: 7227
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:42 pm
Location: Lock Haven PA
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by drseti »

From the pull-quote in the Aviation Consumer article:
aviation_consumer.jpg
aviation_consumer.jpg (28.69 KiB) Viewed 9662 times
Could it be that, when the article was written, those three aircraft were the most widely used in flight schools for primary instruction?

BTW, the word "data" is plural (data are plural?) so that should have said "The data show..."
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
User avatar
designrs
Posts: 1686
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:57 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by designrs »

Very disturbing video. Seems like the instructor should have been on that before if not immediately after the student left the runway. Geez!
BrianL99
Posts: 314
Joined: Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:23 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by BrianL99 »

drseti wrote:From the pull-quote in the Aviation Consumer article:
aviation_consumer.jpg
Could it be that, when the article was written, those three aircraft were the most widely used in flight schools for primary instruction?

BTW, the word "data" is plural (data are plural?) so that should have said "The data show..."
I disagree with your English lesson :)

"Data" is accepted as a "Collective Noun".

http://nxg.me.uk/note/2005/singular-data/
SportPilot
Posts: 1060
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:39 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by SportPilot »

.......
Last edited by SportPilot on Sat Nov 08, 2014 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
drseti
Posts: 7227
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:42 pm
Location: Lock Haven PA
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by drseti »

BrianL99 wrote:"Data" is accepted as a "Collective Noun".
don't you mean data are accepted as collective nouns?
Maybe in England. What do they know about our language?
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
User avatar
drseti
Posts: 7227
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:42 pm
Location: Lock Haven PA
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by drseti »

From that same link:
2.3 There's no such thing as a ‘datum'
Whoever wrote that has never done a wt/bal calculation.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
User avatar
drseti
Posts: 7227
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2009 6:42 pm
Location: Lock Haven PA
Contact:

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by drseti »

SportPilot wrote:The bucket of data shows...
Excellent! Glad to see that you have the verb properly agreeing with the subject, rather than with the noun in the prepositional phrase...
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
CTLSi
Posts: 783
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:38 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by CTLSi »

......
Last edited by CTLSi on Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
designrs
Posts: 1686
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:57 pm

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by designrs »

Possibly a bigger issue to think about... complacency.
A chain of events with warning signs.
Things happen fast.
Wm.Ince
Posts: 1080
Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:27 pm
Location: Clearwater, FL

Re: Fatal(1) Evektor Harmony in Russia

Post by Wm.Ince »

designrs wrote:Possibly a bigger issue to think about... complacency.
A chain of events with warning signs.
Things happen fast.
Exactly.
Intertwined with poor decisions.
Bill Ince
LSRI
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator
Post Reply