PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Paul Hamilton is one of the first persons to become a DPE (Designated Pilot Examiner) for sport pilots. As a full-time author and sport pilot expert, he writes books and produces DVD's for Aviation Supplies and Academics (ASA). Now Paul has graciously agreed to answer your questions here. Thanks Paul! For more information about Paul, please visit www.Paul-Hamilton.com and www.Sport-Pilot-Training.com.

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HZ-SAL
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PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby HZ-SAL » Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:09 am

Good Day,

I am new here and tried to find an answer to my inquiry but could not.

I am a private Pilot flying a light sport aircraft. Can I log the hours on the light sport in my private pilot logbook?

Thank you.

Faisal.
Faisal

PPL/Tecnam Sierra/OETH

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby drseti » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:33 am

Absolutely, Faisal. You are a pilot. The LSA is an airplane. Pilots can log all their hours flying an airplane. Simple! :)
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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby CTLSi » Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:15 am

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Last edited by CTLSi on Sat Nov 29, 2014 10:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby SportPilot » Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:16 am

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Last edited by SportPilot on Mon Nov 24, 2014 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Nomore767
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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby Nomore767 » Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:31 am

drseti wrote:Absolutely, Faisal. You are a pilot. The LSA is an airplane. Pilots can log all their hours flying an airplane. Simple! :)


Faisal,

Welcome! I hope you're enjoying flying in Saudi Arabia. I lived in Bahrain for a couple of years (1966-68) and really love the region. My sister got her PPL in Qatar many years ago. I had a couple of friends who flew for Saudia.

What Paul says above is true. Of course if you're working on your PPL then the type and quality of the time you log must meet the requirements of your county's aviation authority in order to meet the license requirements. However, as Paul says you can log the time in the airplanes you fly.

Be sure to check with your aviation authority and CFI as to the proper requirements. They are the legal authority. Unfortunately there are often many bogus statements made here which could lead you astray. Such as:-

"And if you put a navcom in the plane, you can also log IFR non-IMC."

As a PPL you can only log 'instrument time' when you are the sole manipulator of the controls in IMC as an instrument rated pilot, or simulated instrument conditions with a safety pilot or a CFI. You cannot log IFR in non-IMC. Non-IMC is VMC. Visual conditions. Even instrument rated and on an IFR flight plan if you're flying in VMC, in other words VFR, then you can't log instrument time. I have a little over 1000 hours of actual instrument time over a 28 year airline career when every flight was under IFR.

IFR doesn't mean the flight is flown in Instrument flight 'conditions' but under instrument flight 'rules'. You can fly an IFR flight 100% VFR and not log instrument time, or the whole flight could be in actual conditions and then you can log the whole flight as instrument time. What FAR 61.51 considers “solely by reference to instruments in actual conditions.” What is most typical is that a portion of the flight will be in actual instrument conditions.

You cannot log 'IFR time' unless you are instrument rated, the plane is instrument rated, and the flight conditions are actual or simulated. Stating that adding a nav-com to the airplane makes it IFR is also not true. There are a lot of things that need to be in place and inspected in order to make the plane IFR legal.

I know that you didn't ask about IFR flying but I bring it up as a example of the bogus statements that can appear here and mislead people, especially new and inexperienced pilots.

Once again, welcome and please post abut your experiences flying in Saudi along with any pictures!

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby HZ-SAL » Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:59 am

drseti wrote:Absolutely, Faisal. You are a pilot. The LSA is an airplane. Pilots can log all their hours flying an airplane. Simple! :)


Thank you professor for the reply. Our local Civil Aviation authority follows FAA rules and regulation, hence, do you know where can I find a refrence to this subject in the FAA regulations?

Thanks again.
Faisal.
Faisal

PPL/Tecnam Sierra/OETH

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby HZ-SAL » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:07 pm

Nomore767 wrote:
drseti wrote:Absolutely, Faisal. You are a pilot. The LSA is an airplane. Pilots can log all their hours flying an airplane. Simple! :)


Faisal,

Welcome! I hope you're enjoying flying in Saudi Arabia. I lived in Bahrain for a couple of years (1966-68) and really love the region. My sister got her PPL in Qatar many years ago. I had a couple of friends who flew for Saudia.

What Paul says above is true. Of course if you're working on your PPL then the type and quality of the time you log must meet the requirements of your county's aviation authority in order to meet the license requirements. However, as Paul says you can log the time in the airplanes you fly.

Be sure to check with your aviation authority and CFI as to the proper requirements. They are the legal authority. Unfortunately there are often many bogus statements made here which could lead you astray. Such as:-

"And if you put a navcom in the plane, you can also log IFR non-IMC."

As a PPL you can only log 'instrument time' when you are the sole manipulator of the controls in IMC as an instrument rated pilot, or simulated instrument conditions with a safety pilot or a CFI. You cannot log IFR in non-IMC. Non-IMC is VMC. Visual conditions. Even instrument rated and on an IFR flight plan if you're flying in VMC, in other words VFR, then you can't log instrument time. I have a little over 1000 hours of actual instrument time over a 28 year airline career when every flight was under IFR.

IFR doesn't mean the flight is flown in Instrument flight 'conditions' but under instrument flight 'rules'. You can fly an IFR flight 100% VFR and not log instrument time, or the whole flight could be in actual conditions and then you can log the whole flight as instrument time. What FAR 61.51 considers “solely by reference to instruments in actual conditions.” What is most typical is that a portion of the flight will be in actual instrument conditions.

You cannot log 'IFR time' unless you are instrument rated, the plane is instrument rated, and the flight conditions are actual or simulated. Stating that adding a nav-com to the airplane makes it IFR is also not true. There are a lot of things that need to be in place and inspected in order to make the plane IFR legal.

I know that you didn't ask about IFR flying but I bring it up as a example of the bogus statements that can appear here and mislead people, especially new and inexperienced pilots.

Once again, welcome and please post abut your experiences flying in Saudi along with any pictures!


Thank you for the welcome note. I will definitely share my experience flying in Saudi with all of you. For now you can visit my youtube channel to see some of the videos:

https://www.youtube.com/user/A6FAA/videos


Faisal.
Faisal

PPL/Tecnam Sierra/OETH

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby comperini » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:15 pm

HZ-SAL wrote: Our local Civil Aviation authority follows FAA rules and regulation, hence, do you know where can I find a refrence to this subject in the FAA regulations?


You're looking at this the wrong way.. You won't find a regulation "allowing" it. Instead, you won't find any regulation that prohibits it.

Yes, there is 14 CFR 61.51, which is the regulation dealing with "logging of time", but again, you won't find anything "LSA specific".
- Bob
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http://www.sportpilotinstructor.com

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby Nomore767 » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:27 pm

HZ-SAL wrote:
drseti wrote:Absolutely, Faisal. You are a pilot. The LSA is an airplane. Pilots can log all their hours flying an airplane. Simple! :)


Thank you professor for the reply. Our local Civil Aviation authority follows FAA rules and regulation, hence, do you know where can I find a refrence to this subject in the FAA regulations?

Thanks again.
Faisal.


You can log the time you fly in any airplane. What you will need to do as you work on your license is to make sure you log the type of time required e.g.. solo time, dual time, night time, instrument training etc.

The FAA doesn't so much have regulations about logging time as much as requiring that you log the time required to qualify for a rating or license, and currency.

Your flight school should be able to guide you in this and make sure that you're where you should be.

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby HZ-SAL » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:38 pm

Thanks all for the help.

When I went for my PPL renewal (it was in UAE and they have recently switch to JAR rules) my CFI crossed out my hours in the LSA in the logbook, and said since the aircraft is less than 12500 lbs you cannot log the hrs.

Anyways I will follow the norm in the US and start logging hrs in my PPL logbook.

Faisal
Faisal

PPL/Tecnam Sierra/OETH

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby Merlinspop » Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:22 pm

HZ-SAL wrote:Thanks all for the help.

When I went for my PPL renewal (it was in UAE and they have recently switch to JAR rules) my CFI crossed out my hours in the LSA in the logbook, and said since the aircraft is less than 12500 lbs you cannot log the hrs.

Anyways I will follow the norm in the US and start logging hrs in my PPL logbook.

Faisal

You may want to have a firm discussion with your CFI regarding defacing YOUR property. 12,500 is a LOT of airplane. The Beechcraft King Air 250 has a Maximum Takeoff Weight of 12,500. Surely your CFI would agree that you can log hours flown in aircraft smaller than that.

At any rate, welcome to the board and I also look forward to reading about your experiences.
- Bruce

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby HZ-SAL » Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:45 pm

Merlinspop wrote:
HZ-SAL wrote:Thanks all for the help.

When I went for my PPL renewal (it was in UAE and they have recently switch to JAR rules) my CFI crossed out my hours in the LSA in the logbook, and said since the aircraft is less than 12500 lbs you cannot log the hrs.

Anyways I will follow the norm in the US and start logging hrs in my PPL logbook.

Faisal

You may want to have a firm discussion with your CFI regarding defacing YOUR property. 12,500 is a LOT of airplane. The Beechcraft King Air 250 has a Maximum Takeoff Weight of 12,500. Surely your CFI would agree that you can log hours flown in aircraft smaller than that.

At any rate, welcome to the board and I also look forward to reading about your experiences.



Sorry, I meant 2,250 lbs.
Faisal

PPL/Tecnam Sierra/OETH

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Re: PPL logging hrs in a LSA

Postby Merlinspop » Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:55 pm

HZ-SAL wrote:Sorry, I meant 2,250 lbs.


Whew! That's better. :)

Perhaps it's a local nuance of the regulations... maybe?
- Bruce


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