When Did My Third Class Medical Expire

[MrLupin]

At least some of you will understand the genesis of this question given the inclusion of the Pilot Protection Act II in the US. House and Senate versions of the FAA Reauthorization bill.

I received a second class medical in July of 2007 and turned 40 in April of 2008. I'm trying to determine the point at which my second class medical became a third class medical and then the point at which my third class medical expired. The PPAII states that airman who have had a current medical within the 10 years prior to passage of the law need not visit a AME. I understand that under the old rules a second class medical would expire after a year at which point it would become a third class medical for an additional 36 months (for airmen under age 40. At age 40 the maximum amount of time the third class would remain valid was, and remains under the new rules, 24 months. For purposes of the PPAII AME visit what is my cut-off point?

It seems that, under the old rules, my second class expired in August of 2004. At that point it became a third class for 36 months which would take me to August of 2007. If I am correct then the House and Senate will need to pass the FAA reauthorization bill and Obama will have to sign it before August of 2017 (which looks very likely).

Am I making any sense? Comments?

[SportPilot]

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[SportPilot]

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[3Dreaming]

First off the medical doesn't change, the privileges you can exercise do. IIRC during that period yor medical would have been good for 36 calander months from the date it was issued if you were under 40, 12 months for exercising 2nd class privileges, and 24 months of 3rd class privileges. I do have a 2007 FAR in my office at work that I can check tomorrow. If I am correct in my thinking you would have not been able to exercise privileges requiring a 3rd class medical after the end of July 2010.

[SportPilot]

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[Nomore767]

I found this:

"FAA MEDICAL CERTIFICATE DURATION CHANGE
On 7/10/2008 the FAA issued a Final FAR Rule for it's NPRM (notice of proposed rulemaking) related to the duration of first-class and third-class medical certificates. This is now the rule and is retroactive to include pilots who's medical certificates previously expired. This rule extends the duration of both first and third class medicals for individuals under the age of 40.

The FAA extended the duration of first-class medical certificate to one year, for pilots under the age of 40.

The FAA extended the duration of third-class medical certificates to five years for pilots under the age of 40. The FAA developed this new proposal after reviewing ICAO (International Civil Aviation Authority) standards, accident statistics, medical literature and FAA medical certification statistics.

No change for second-class medical certificates.

NPRM comments for Docket Number FAA-2007-27812 were received through June 11, 2007.

FAA Medical Certification DurationCertificate Duration Summary, FAA AME Guide."

This leads me to believe that MrLupin is good for 60 months plus 10 years from date of issue of his last medical. I would call the FAA and find out for sure, but it's probably a moot point. The PBORII will probably be enacted within a matter of a few months IMHO.

Here is the medical duration chart contained in the current CFR: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/896 ... 61.23.docx

Jim,

Not sure about the "10 years from the date of issue of his last medical" part.

The following is from AOPA's site:_

"As amended, the Pilot's Bill of Rights 2 would allow hundreds of thousands of pilots who have held a valid third class medical, either regular or special issuance, within 10 years of the legislation’s enactment to fly without needing to get another FAA medical exam. It would apply to pilots flying VFR or IFR in aircraft weighing up to 6,000 pounds and carrying up to five passengers at altitudes below 18,000 feet and speeds up to 250 knots.

For pilots whose medical certificate lapsed more than 10 years before the legislation is enacted and those who have never held a medical certificate, a one-time medical certification will be required. After a pilot has been medically certified once, either through the regular or special issuance process, he or she will also be able to fly indefinitely without needing to go through the FAA medical certification process again."

To me this indicates the 10 years has a couple of points:-

1) 10 years from the last date the medical was valid NOT the date it was issued. i.e.. it lapsed when it was no longer current. So he had a valid medical on the last day of the calendar month it expired.

2) more than 10 years before the legislation was enacted.

This implies that if the pilot's last date of medical currency is exactly 10 years from the date of enactment then they are within the new rule. If they were MORE than 10 years (i.e.. 10 years plus a day or more) then they require the one time medical. If that was the last day that pilot's medical was current then that's the date the pilot uses.

Then there's the matter of when the medical 'expires' which is also the last day it is 'current'. 60th month after the month of the date of examination shown on the medical certificate.


I found this:-

http://www.flightsurgeon.com/medcertvalid

Which states the following (as well as provides an easier to understand grid). It says:-

If you are a Third Class Pilot look at the date of your Medical Certificate. If you are under 40 years old, it will be valid for 5 years and expires at the end of the calendar month in which it was issued. If you are a First Class Pilot and under 40 years old, your First Class Medical Certificate will be valid for one year. After one year it drops to a Third Class Medical Certificate and it will be valid as a Third Class Medical Certificate for 4 more years. It does not drop in class to a Class 2 Medical Certificate at the end of the first year.

All Class 2 Medical Certificates are valid for 1 year, regardless of age. After the first year the Second Class Medical Certificate will be valid only as a Third Class Certificate for an additional 4 years if you were under age 40 at the issue date, but only for 1 additional year as a Third Class Certificate if you were age 40 or older at the date of issue.

At age 35 or older, all First Class Pilots will need an initial ECG. If it is normal they will not need another ECG until they turn 40.

After age 40 First Class Pilots need an ECG once a year, however, the First Class Medical Certificate is only valid as a First Class Certificate for 6 months. This means that First Class Pilots over age 40 will need two FAA Medical Exams a year to maintain their First Class certification, but an ECG at only one of them.

If a First Class Certificate is not renewed at 6 months, it drops in class to a Second Class Certificate for another 6 months. After the first year, it drops in class to that of a Third Class Medical Certificate and will be valid for an additional 1 year as a Third Class (age 40 and over).

Mr Lupin says:-
"I received a second class medical in July of 2007 and turned 40 in April of 2008. I'm trying to determine the point at which my second class medical became a third class medical and then the point at which my third class medical expired."

I would say his Second Class medical expired on the last day of July 2008 and became a third class medical as of August 1st 2008.
This in turn expired the last day of Aug 2012. (four more years since he was under 40 when it was issued). Also :-
"60th month after the month of the date of examination shown on the medical certificate."

He's had no more medical exams since so his medical lapsed on Aug 31st 2012. So according to PBOR2 for Mr Lupin to NOT require a one time medical the legislation must be enacted no later than Aug 31st 2022.
The last day he HELD a valid medical was Aug 31st 2012.

[Nomore767]

At least some of you will understand the genesis of this question given the inclusion of the Pilot Protection Act II in the US. House and Senate versions of the FAA Reauthorization bill.

I received a second class medical in July of 2007 and turned 40 in April of 2008. I'm trying to determine the point at which my second class medical became a third class medical and then the point at which my third class medical expired. The PPAII states that airman who have had a current medical within the 10 years prior to passage of the law need not visit a AME. I understand that under the old rules a second class medical would expire after a year at which point it would become a third class medical for an additional 36 months (for airmen under age 40. At age 40 the maximum amount of time the third class would remain valid was, and remains under the new rules, 24 months. For purposes of the PPAII AME visit what is my cut-off point?

It seems that, under the old rules, my second class expired in August of 2004. At that point it became a third class for 36 months which would take me to August of 2007. If I am correct then the House and Senate will need to pass the FAA reauthorization bill and Obama will have to sign it before August of 2017 (which looks very likely).

Am I making any sense? Comments?

What I find confusing is where you say under the old rules your medical expired in August 2004 when you've just said you received your second class medical in July 2007? So not sure of your dates here. It sounds like you're talking a bout a previous second class medical but then you took another medical in July of 2007 which supersedes the previous one and so the dates are based on the last medical.

Sport Pilot's post above quoting the revised rule change states that its retroactive. Also whilst it changes first and third class it doesn't change the second class per se.
So the second class expires at the end of July 2008. It becomes third class August 2008 and expires Aug 31st 2012. 60th month after the month of the date of examination shown on the medical certificate.(one year second class, four years third class).

[SportPilot]

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[ANewHope]

I know this thread is a few weeks old, but I was wondering if people honestly believe PBORIIwill pass, or if that's sarcasm? AOPA forum and the POA board seem to think it has no shot.

And the latest version still requires your physician to put in writing that you're safe to fly, right? I doubt that's much easier to accomplish from an untrained general public physician as opposed to an AME looking at a specific set of requirements.

[Nomore767]

I know this thread is a few weeks old, but I was wondering if people honestly believe PBORIIwill pass, or if that's sarcasm? AOPA forum and the POA board seem to think it has no shot.

And the latest version still requires your physician to put in writing that you're safe to fly, right? I doubt that's much easier to accomplish from an untrained general public physician as opposed to an AME looking at a specific set of requirements.

As far as I know the pilot's personal physician follows a 'checklist' of medical items to review regarding the pilot's 'fitness to fly' and then the plot is required to log the visit in his/her logbook.

I believe it will pass, the only unknown being...when.

[SportPilot]

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[Half Fast]

If they would just follow that common sense approach for the initial exam the world would be a happier place.

When's I was racing sports cars, that's pretty much the method the SCCA used. They provided a form, take it to any doctor for an exam, he checked off the form. IIRC, he attached a copy of the first ekg, then only attached another one in following years if there was a notable change.

I had several of mine done at walk-in clinics that did sports physicals and employment physicals. $50, no fuss.

If that's adequate for me to go 3-wide at 140mph into the Sebring hairpin, why shouldn't it be good enough to fly a small plane?

[SportPilot]

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[drseti]

If that's adequate for me to go 3-wide at 140mph into the Sebring hairpin, why shouldn't it be good enough to fly a small plane?

In an LSA, you can fly that Sebring hairpin (only 1 wide) at 138 MPH with no medical at all! Why else do you think I go to Sport Aviation Expo every year?

[Half Fast]

SportPilot, they still require an exam from an AME and a 3rd class medical initially, then it goes to the 4 year, any doc thing from there on.