If you are flying with steam gauges and/or do not have at least a panel mounted GPS with moving map or an EFB in the cockpit with GPS, then you are open to possible tragedy.
A panel mount not only provides the sectionals (like a Garmin 796 or Dynon or Garmin touch) but can also quickly be used to find an alternate airport and create a navigation route by hitting the Direct button.
Here is a fatal crash where a pilot had requested an alternate airfield from ATC and was directed to a non-existent airfield that no longer existed. The pilot could not apparently verify that ATC was misdirecting him until it was too late.
http://www.flyingmag.com/technique/acci ... NDQwNDQwS0
Why Panel GPS Is Critical
Moderator: drseti
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
That is pure, unadulteratedCTLSi wrote:If you are flying with steam gauges and/or do not have at least a panel mounted GPS with moving map or an EFB in the cockpit with GPS, then you are open to possible tragedy.
The same could be said, "open to possible tragedy," for the most sophisticated flight deck in the world.
"The best safety device in any aircraft is a well trained pilot."
Bill Ince
LSRI
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator
LSRI
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
I'd have to agree with WM.Ince. First, how do we know they didn't have a GPS? According to the prelim report this was an "on demand air taxi flight" and I would imagine anyone doing that would have additional navigation aides. As a new student pilot/aircraft owner, I know that as PIC you're suppose to know where your alternatives are. From what I've read they were directing him to a non-existent "strip" in Bethpage. I know Bethpage has a rather large golf course but perhaps he could not see it.
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
CTLSi assumes panel mounted GPS are something new. I put a Garmin GNC 150 in my Bellanca Super Viking back in 1995. It came with a Jeppesen database and handy little "NRST" button -- just like every GPS has today. I think it's a near certainty that a Bonanza flying air taxi had at least one GPS.
And before my GNC 150 and GPS in general, I had a "Loran Com" that had similar functionality.
And before my GNC 150 and GPS in general, I had a "Loran Com" that had similar functionality.
dave
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
Amazing that airliners crossed all the world's oceans 30 years before there was GPS in their cockpits. Some of the older planes relied on a SEXTANT to cross-check position, and they still got where they were going.
Oh, the tragedy!
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
Great to see a lively forum again!
I strongly prefer my iPad with ForeFlight over my panel mounted Garmin 696. Still I'm glad the Garmin in there for:
1) Redunduncy and position confirmation. It's good to know that both GPSs say that I'm in the same place.
2) "Threading the needle" between airspace. The 696 zooms in nicely for exact positioning, glare free. Although I'm not an advocate of this practice, some areas such as Florida, present a maze of airspace sometimes offering a very narrow corridor between airspace which may be necessary to utilize to avoid weather or to get where you need to go.
3) "Direct To" counts the miles to destination... perfect for calling a tower and pinpointing distance to airport.
4) The 696 feeds the audio alerts for terrain / obstacles / altitude etc.
I strongly prefer my iPad with ForeFlight over my panel mounted Garmin 696. Still I'm glad the Garmin in there for:
1) Redunduncy and position confirmation. It's good to know that both GPSs say that I'm in the same place.
2) "Threading the needle" between airspace. The 696 zooms in nicely for exact positioning, glare free. Although I'm not an advocate of this practice, some areas such as Florida, present a maze of airspace sometimes offering a very narrow corridor between airspace which may be necessary to utilize to avoid weather or to get where you need to go.
3) "Direct To" counts the miles to destination... perfect for calling a tower and pinpointing distance to airport.
4) The 696 feeds the audio alerts for terrain / obstacles / altitude etc.
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
MrMorden wrote:
Amazing that airliners crossed all the world's oceans 30 years before there was GPS in their cockpits. Some of the older planes relied on a SEXTANT to cross-check position, and they still got where they were going.
Oh, the tragedy!
Well.....not always.
http://news.discovery.com/history/us-hi ... 141028.htm
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/25/world ... .html?_r=0
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
Yep, you have to wonder how anyone could fly this F-86A at 670 MPH and was able to find an airport to land at, without GPS.MrMorden wrote:
Amazing that airliners crossed all the world's oceans 30 years before there was GPS in their cockpits. Some of the older planes relied on a SEXTANT to cross-check position, and they still got where they were going.
Oh, the tragedy!
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Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
That's easy.BrianL99 wrote:. . . "you have to wonder how anyone could fly this F-86A at 670 MPH and was able to find an airport to land at, without GPS." . . .
It's called radar, GCA's and TACAN.
Bill Ince
LSRI
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator
LSRI
Retired Heavy Equipment Operator
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
You have to wonder how anyone flying that F-86A at 670 MPH could find anything in that panel.
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
ergonomics, schmergonomics.
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
"You've never been lost until you're lost at Mach 3."
~ Richard Grahm, SR-71 Blackbird
Mach 3 = 2,000 kts
JFK to Washington in 5 minutes!
(Or two hours in my plane.)
~ Richard Grahm, SR-71 Blackbird
Mach 3 = 2,000 kts
JFK to Washington in 5 minutes!
(Or two hours in my plane.)
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
Ha!
Andy Walker
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Athens, GA
Sport Pilot ASEL, LSRI
2007 Flight Design CTSW E-LSA
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
So, the average trip in your plane only takes one hour 55 minutes more than it would in an SR-71? Not bad, Richard.designrs wrote:(Or two hours in my plane.)
The opinions posted are those of one CFI, and do not necessarily represent the FAA or its lawyers.
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
Prof H Paul Shuch
PhD CFII DPE LSRM-A/GL/WS/PPC iRMT
AvSport LLC, KLHV
[email protected]
AvSport.org
facebook.com/SportFlying
SportPilotExaminer.US
Re: Why Panel GPS Is Critical
I don't think they had TACAN around when the F-86A was produced. If I'm not mistaken, the majority of F-86A's were produced prior to the Korean War and TACAN didn't come out until the mid-late 50's.Wm.Ince wrote:That's easy.BrianL99 wrote:. . . "you have to wonder how anyone could fly this F-86A at 670 MPH and was able to find an airport to land at, without GPS." . . .
It's called radar, GCA's and TACAN.