Sport Pilot Talk

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

ruo wrote: What say you, artp?

I am glad Tom apologized for saying I did not have a thermostat and for saying he did not receive a letter from me.

However saying the thermostat works on a web forum does not make it so. I still have a dealer who has refused to even try to fix it but instead charged me for putting tape on the radiator.

I still have a dealer who requires 2-4 weeks to schedule an appointment and a month to get parts. I still have a dealer who gets the vast majority of his work from Cirrus (he is also a certified Diamond service center) and so probably doesn't much care what Flight Design wants.

While Tom has made a nice support offer, I would still have to go to the same dealer (who has not contacted me or acknowledged Toms offer in any way), so I am still selling the plane.

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

[quote="artp"] ruo wrote: What say you, artp?

I am glad Tom apologized for saying I did not have a thermostat and for saying he did not receive a letter from me.

However saying the thermostat works on a web forum does not make it so. I still have a dealer who has refused to even try to fix it but instead charged me for putting tape on the radiator.

I still have a dealer who said the radio static under full throttle was because the intercom is not compatible with Light Speed headsets. I still have a dealer who after 6 months has not been able to fix a landing light or a CHT probe.

I still have a dealer who requires 2-4 weeks to schedule an appointment and a month to get parts. I still have a dealer who gets the vast majority of his work from Cirrus (he is also a certified Diamond service center) and so probably doesn't much care what Flight Design wants.

While Tom has made a nice support offer, I would still have to go to the same dealer (who has not contacted me or acknowledged Tom's offer in any way), so I am still selling the plane.

Roger · Joined: 22 Jun 2006 Posts: 83

Is the price still $94,000 as in a previous post?

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

Roger wrote: Is the price still $94,000 as in a previous post?

Yes. At the moment I seem to have two interested parties (both dealers).

CharlieTango · Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 8:24 am Post subject:

Tom wrote: ... the thermostat system on the CT series works very well down to about 25F and when operating at lower temperatures, it needs a little help blocking off a bit of the flow on the cooler... TP

artp wrote: ...However saying the thermostat works on a web forum does not make it so...

art,

notice how tom qualified his remark and said downt to about 25F then some help (tape) is needed? your doing that thing you do when you argue, you are slippery :)

this got me thinking, why the limitation? thermostats are not new technology. then again an oil thermostat on a dry-sump motor does present another challenge. the engine will pump oil out ( to the oil tank ) and therefore require replacement oil so some flow is required.

i would rather have an oil thermostat that didn't need any help down below zero F but i bet i would prefer down to 25F over no thermostat at all.

CharlieTango · Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Price

artp wrote: Roger wrote: Is the price still $94,000 as in a previous post?

Yes. At the moment I seem to have two interested parties (both dealers).

art,

why don't you set up an auction and see if you can extend this thread past 10 pages?

CharlieTango · Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 8:36 am Post subject: Re: Price

artp wrote: Roger wrote: Is the price still $94,000 as in a previous post?

Yes. At the moment I seem to have two interested parties (both dealers).

at $94k you definitely have interest from private parties as well, but it does sound like your bashing was more effective when you claim it is only dealers.

here's an example from the ct forum

=============================

ArtP,
You are in MD? Where abouts? I'm up here for work right now and would like to look at your ctsw. I saw on another forum, for get the name right now that you will take 94,000.

John

===========================

Roger · Joined: 22 Jun 2006 Posts: 83

Art

There is a fellow on www.ctflyer.com that's interested in your plane that's for sale.

Roger H

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

Roger wrote: Art

There is a fellow on www.ctflyer.com that's interested in your plane that's for sale.

Roger H

Thanks. I just received a private message from him (another dealer).

Super Cub · Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 25 Location: PA

IMO, Whoever gets there in front of the stampede is going to save themselves $25,000!

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

After thinking about it for a while, I would first like to apologize to my service center for accepting Tom Peghiny’s word that I did not have a thermostat on my plane.

At this point I have Tom saying the thermostat design works fine and my service center saying it doesn’t. I now have to decide which is correct. The trouble is that I have no way to make that determination. I am not an engineer. The fact that the service center told me this over the phone without even looking at my plane makes me suspect they have had previous experience with the problem and are therefore more believable. In Tom’s posting to this forum he indicated that he notified Flight Design in Germany of my problem (my service center said that Flight Design is already aware of the problem) this indicates to me he suspects the problem is with the thermostat rather than the service center.

As a separate subject, my service center clearly has more work than it can handle. The problem, for me, is that with a CTsw I do not have the option of going to another service center.

To keep thinks in prospective CharlieTango keeps pointing out that the Flight Design is the number one selling LSA. That my be true but according to the FAA, in Maryland (where I live) there is one (1) Flight Design plane registered compared to 763 Cessna 100 series (small single engine) planes. Which company do you think will be able to offer more service facilities and which company, if there is a valid dispute with a service center, will be better able to intervene on behalf of the customer?

On paper the Cessna LSA is not as good as the Flight Design but it is far superior in terms of ability to provide after sale support to the owner.

CharlieTango will respond how pleased he is with Flight Design. I am happy for him, but that does not solve my problem. As I said in an earlier post, check on the availability of after sale service and support before you decide on a plane.

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

I went for my service appointment today.

I now have a working landing light , CHT probe, and door struts that keep the doors open.

Today the temperature hit 80+ so I removed tape from the radiator because I was worried it might overheat. I could have saved the time. I have now flown in temperatures from the 20’s to the 80’s, with and without aluminum tape and the oil temperature stays in the 150 to 170 degree range. It is clear that the thermostat works, it is just the wrong one for this plane. Rotax calls for a normal operating range from 190 to 230.