Sport Pilot Talk

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

Finally, clear skies and no wind. It is night but I didn't see that as a problem. Preflight I found the landing light doesn't work, the instrument lights on the backup instruments and magnetic compass don't work, and the lights for the fuel tubes don't work. That was a no go for me.

Super Cub · Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 25 Location: PA

Will you have to take your plane back to the dealer to get the lights working

or will someone local look at it?

ka7eej · Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 55 Location: Taylor, Az

While I continue to feel sorry for you and your problems with your CT. I am glad that you found these problems during preflight and not during. a flight. I am puzzled by the night flight. AS this is a Sport Pilot website I am wondering what type of license and medical you have at this time and why you thought that a night flight was a good idea on this new airplane you have had so many problems with?

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

Super Cub wrote: Will you have to take your plane back to the dealer to get the lights working

or will someone local look at it?

I am pretty sure that to be covered by the warranty I will have to go back to the dealer.

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

ka7eej wrote: I am puzzled by the night flight. AS this is a Sport Pilot website I am wondering what type of license and medical you have at this time and why you thought that a night flight was a good idea on this new airplane you have had so many problems with?

I currently have a commercial certificate with a 2nd class medical. I consider this a sport plane website.

As for flying at night being a good idea with this plane and its problems, day is no better. Either the plane can be flown or it can't. While I am starting to lean toward the it can't be flown side, if it can be flown safely then it can be flown safely at night.

CharlieTango · Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:44 am Post subject:

art,

you might want to get involved with how the lighting is done.

the red LED's for the sight tubes work well and shouldn't be a big concern.

the whiskey compass i have never seen lit and may not be included. you might want to talk to you dealer and make sure your both on the same page in terms of what lighting you bought. looking at the price/option list it isn't clear to me if the lighting is included with the dynon.

your backup gauges is where i would consider how i would want it to be lit. the typical or traditional light would be led light rings. the problem with the light rings is they take up room and force the steam gauges to be recessed. when they are recessed the numbers can be hidden from view by the panel cut outs and the result can be that you only see the hash marks and not the numbers.

the solution that i like here the best is a red LED spot light mounted on the bulkhead.

obviously a flashlight and a backup flashlight are prudent.

the landing light is an ongoing issue. when the bottom cowling is removed the landing light has to be unplugged. it is a quick connect and takes a moment to rectify. if that isn't the issue, check the breaker and the bulb. i have replaced 1 bulb in 300 hours. this small peanut light works surprisingly well.

the landing light is a big issue on an approach with 30 or 40 degrees and a low power setting. in this configuration you are pitched down quite a lot and need to maintain that attitude until you are very close to the ground. timing the round out in this configuration is critical and night conditions isn't the best place to start.

same is true for landings in general, visual clues in the ctsw are "different" and it might be best to work in the daytime until you get a feel for the ct.

CharlieTango · Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:11 am Post subject:

artp wrote: ... Either the plane can be flown or it can't..

you ct was first test flown in europe and then again at the re-assembly and certification. it was also flown to your field so it is a pretty safe bet that it can be flown.

artp wrote: .. As for flying at night being a good idea with this plane and its problems, day is no better ... While I am starting to lean toward the it can't be flown side, if it can be flown safely then it can be flown safely at night.

safety margins are reduced at night, you are correct that the ctsw can be flown safely at night but not prior to your transition training.

the ctsw is a "pitch attitude" airplane, meaning that focusing more on pitch attitude than airspeed is a good approach to keep you from chasing the airspeed you are looking for. at night your visual clues that determine pitch attitude might be missing or even misleading so it is better to get a daytime feel 1st.

as well the visibility in the ct varies a lot through the windscreen as you configure for landing, round out and flare, the visibility through the door windows remains wide open but at night you have no light out the sides. the view out the sides is helpful to get the feel of landing a ctsw.

i would suggest 50 day landings in various conditions even for an experienced pilot like yourself before doing night landings. landing a ctsw isn't hard but it is different.

remember you were going to sell your ctsw instead of fly it due to your concern about landings as well as fuel management. while i think it makes sense to fly your ct, why the swing from one extreme to the other?

certainly learning landings, handling, and fuel management are best done in the light of day 1st.

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

CharlieTango wrote: certainly learning landings, handling, and fuel management are best done in the light of day 1st.

I can't rationally argue with that advice. It is just that I have owned the plane since 11/04 and this was my first opportunity to solo. In fact it would be my first solo in over 3 years. I am afraid if I find excuses not to do it, I won't.

ka7eej · Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 55 Location: Taylor, Az

First solo in over 3 years... Did you have a CFI with you who knows the CT? What are you, NUTS??

Sorry Charlie Tango, you are trying to be so nice and helpful to this guy. Someone needs to get his attention. Everytime someone takes the cowling off my Allegro I have to go back and plug in the landing light...so what get used to it.....and I agree with Charlie Tango,,,you may be complaining about night lighting features that you did not even order or pay for...

Hey listen up!! go fly (during the day) with a CFI who knows the CT. Get to know this airplane(like my Allegro its not hard just different) Then go out and start having fun...... MOST OF ALL >>>>>BE SAFE!!

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

ka7eej wrote: you may be complaining about night lighting features that you did not even order or pay for...

Hey listen up!! go fly (during the day) with a CFI who knows the CT. Get to know this airplane(like my Allegro its not hard just different) Then go out and start having fun...... MOST OF ALL >>>>>BE SAFE!!

I paid $899 for the night lighting. While the landing light may be unplugged that doesn't explain what happened to the rest of the lighting.

I currently have 7.5 hours and 30 landings in a CTSW. While not a great deal of experience, it should be enough to solo. The CFI was provided by the dealer and has as much CT experience as I am likely to find.

CharlieTango · Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:17 am Post subject:

artp wrote: ...it would be my first solo in over 3 years. I am afraid if I find excuses not to do it, I won't.

sounds like you are letting a little honesty creep in :wink:

i find myself agreeing with you, you should solo again as soon as it is prudent. what you need to do is set yourself up for success.

you did a good job of setting yourself up for failure this time. you admitted that you tied down the airplane without checking it out because you couldn't bear the thought that you find another or more squawks.

you elected a night first solo even though you find "your safety issue" to be paramount.

this time set yourself up for success. you have the keys and the rating. your explanation of your transition training is suspect.

artp wrote: I currently have 7.5 hours and 30 landings in a CTSW. While not a great deal of experience, it should be enough to solo.

for some 10 minutes is enough and for others 10 hours is not enough. you cannot judge by the number of hours and landings alone. you are likely correct but the basis should be things like; obtaining an endorsement from a cfi ( your insurance should require this ) and demonstrating proficiency. if you have the endorsement and you can demonstrate consistent good landings then by all means.

my advice to you is to fly 25 hours in the daytime, learn the plane and it's issues. then fly to the dealer for an oil change and an inspection and to correct squawks while you watch or have a burger.

you have decided to fly the ctsw so begin to see both sides of the coin. your web persona is completely negative regarding the ctsw and if that is your actual mind set than how could you expect to find the experience rewarding?

the ctsw is fun to fly because it is so maneuverable and this feature enhances safety. you can fly very tight patterns and learn to slow down rapidly and this will allow you to mix up with faster aircraft more safely. also you will probably find that you can bank steeper giving your visibility back upon leveling your wings much faster.

stop in at the ct forum and say something positive, it will be good for getting the mindset right.

another thing to remember is that you can fly frequently, weather permitting due to the low operating costs. i suspect that after 30 ctsw landings your skills have been developed a little. go with this it will make you safer and put a smile on your face.

best

ec

artp · Joined: 03 May 2007 Posts: 144 Location: Odenton, Md

CharlieTango wrote: sounds like you are letting a little honesty creep in :wink:

I have always been honest, it is just that you don't like some of the things I say. :)

Jim Stewart · Joined: 12 Oct 2006 Posts: 46

Art,

I bought a CTSW new without a license, experience or other pilots' advice. I've had over 100 hours instruction, with about 80 hours and 250 landings in the CT. I won't tell you it was easy. It wasn't, and the most painful part was finding out that I'm not an intuitive pilot.

The biggest thing I've learned with all of this is that you won't break the plane or yourself if you're always ready and willing to go around. Being a rookie and getting that advice from wise old guys, I've had no problem going around when things don't look right. The other thing is that when you are flying alone, fly with full tanks. The extra weight decreases pitch sensitivity somewhat and makes flairing easier.

A hard landing won't break your plane. Just watch the airspeed until you're over the fence and flair when you're close enough to the ground to read a newspaper on the centerline. If it bounces or the nose gets cocked at an angle, just go around. No harm done.

I really hope you can learn to enjoy your plane. My wife and I love ours, and hope to see you at a fly-in some day.

Good luck.

Roger · Joined: 22 Jun 2006 Posts: 73

Over at www.ctflyer.com we have a "taking possession checklist". It helps prevent inadvertently overlooked items that may need to be worked on or adjusted before taking delivery of your CT.

Roger

Super Cub · Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 25 Location: PA

Roger,
Where do I look for the taking possession checklist over on CTFlyer?
I can't find it.