Sport Pilot Talk

nbjeeptj · Joined: 23 Jun 2011 Posts: 46 Location: Gilbert SC

I passed my check ride today. 7 months of work and I can take my wife with me now. The oral part of the test was a 3.2hr deal and about 1.5 hr flying. I think the DPE was real hard core but maby they all are.

drseti · Joined: 28 Nov 2009 Posts: 1390 Location: Lock Haven PA

Congratulations, and welcome to the fraternity of pilots! Keep learning, fly safely, and most of all, have fun.

Jim Stewart · Joined: 12 Oct 2006 Posts: 259

Excellent. Fly safe, give your wife a pleasant flight and have fun.

designrs · Joined: 23 Sep 2009 Posts: 144

nbjeeptj wrote: I passed my check ride today. 7 months of work and I can take my wife with me now. The oral part of the test was a 3.2hr deal and about 1.5 hr flying. I think the DPE was real hard core but maby they all are.

Congrats!
Wow! Is a 3.2 hour oral normal?

Jack Tyler · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:42 pm Post subject:

It's always a treat to hear about a new license issued. It's good news for the sport/lifestyle/industry...but it's especially good news for the new pilot and the future s/he has in aviation. Congrats!

bryancobb · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:05 pm Post subject: Re: Check ride stress over

designrs wrote: ...Wow! Is a 3.2 hour oral normal?

With the new generation of Sport Pilot DPE's, with their FAA checklist in-hand...yes.

Take a private pilot checkride with a DPE that has been a pilot for 30 years and the oral MIGHT last 1.5 max.

Truth is, an experience examiner can tell if you are ignorant or know your stuff, in 30 minutes.

To TRULY hit all the marks that the DPE's are told are MANDATORY areas of questioning, would take 4 or 5 hours.

nbjeeptj · Joined: 23 Jun 2011 Posts: 46 Location: Gilbert SC

Had a few issues with the maint records on the airplane that took up some time. Apparently the airplane I bought did not have the transponder and ELT endorsements per the Regulations and the DPE was hardcore.

fredg · Joined: 04 Sep 2010 Posts: 13 Location: Iowa City

My SP oral (2009) was about two hours. The examiner was thorough but also made it comfortable and educational. It helped that I was prepared (IMHO!).

hink · Joined: 17 Jan 2012 Posts: 17 Location: Canton, GA

nbjeeptj wrote: I passed my check ride today. 7 months of work and I can take my wife with me now. The oral part of the test was a 3.2hr deal and about 1.5 hr flying. I think the DPE was real hard core but maby they all are.

Most everyone reports these 3-4 hour oral exams. I cannot wrap my head around it. Is that including the preflight of the airplane and perhaps working some W&B and performance numbers? It just seems like a lot of time. What is the nature of the questions, rapid fire or more discussion?

comperini · Joined: 24 Feb 2008 Posts: 152 Location: California

hink wrote:
Most everyone reports these 3-4 hour oral exams.

3-4 hours total elapsed time for the entire practical exam, I can understand. But 3+ hours on just the oral part does seem a little excessive.

drseti · Joined: 28 Nov 2009 Posts: 1390 Location: Lock Haven PA

comperini wrote: 3+ hours on just the oral part does seem a little excessive.

True, Bob, but as long as the DPE is charging flat-rate and not by the hour, I'd rather the student have a long oral and short checkride than vice-versa.

Paul Hamilton · Joined: 21 May 2007 Posts: 351 Location: Reno/Tahoe Nevada

Just finished a checkride yesterday for an applicant and the oral took about 2 hours. My orals for proficiency checks and checkrides range from 1.5 hours to 4.5 hours. The time for the oral simply depends on the CFI who thought/recommended applicant and the applicant’s knowledge and ability to focus on the PTS tasks.
Today, it is the examiners responsibility to provide a valid checkride. This means the paperwork needs to be in order before the checkride can begin. For the actual oral portion of the checkride the items in the PTS must be covered. Pretty simple.
In the olden days, before attorneys and insurance companies, FAA examiners probably did pass people based on incomplete paperwork, how they “felt” about them, what they looked like, how well they liked them, how they answered the first questions, etc…. But not more recently since the attorneys and insurance companies got involved. Things have changed
I am sure there are all types of examiners out there just like doctors, attorneys, engineers, teachers CFI’s, bankers, accountants, etc……and the list goes on. So you will get a wide range from hardcore to the easy “Santa Class” (as the FAA calls them) who provide invalid checkrides. The problem with FAA examiners not providing valid checkrides per the PTS, is that the pilots can lose their licenses if the examiner gets caught. This is a disservice to everyone. Any examiner who gets caught is usually not an examiner for long. The FAA is weeding out FAA examiners who are providing invalid checkrides/practical tests.
Nbjeeptj, congratulations and be happy that your CFI trained you to get through the hardcore examiner (not being there it is hard to intelligently comment on your actual situation). Hardcore can mean different things to different people. It would have been nice to be forewarned about having the aircraft legal to fly before the checkride. The old timer examiner here that does the private, commercial, soaring, instrument, etc. checkrides is very methodical about the aircraft paperwork because he knows the consequences.
It is simply the CFI’s responsibility to prepare applicants for the checkride with the aeronautical knowledge and stick/rudder skills.
I personally want to perform a valid checkride as quickly and easily as possible so here is a tip I provide applicants before the checkride “We both want to get through this as quickly and easily as possible. Keep your answers as short as you can. If I need more information I will ask for it.” In other words, don’t run off at the mouth.
Picking your flight instructor is the most important decision for getting through your checkride the easiest. It turns out that with the highly qualified CFI’s, applicants have fun and feel proud of their accomplishment after taking a checkride.
Hopefully this will be helpful.

comperini · Joined: 24 Feb 2008 Posts: 152 Location: California

Well for what it's worth... for about a year, AFS-610 wanted examiners to submit a report of how much time was spent on the oral, and flight portion of the sport pilot exams, so they could track how much time was being spent. My POI told me that the average time for orals was around the 1.5 to 2 hours mark for the oral portion of the exam.

bryancobb · Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:12 pm Post subject: More Like It

comperini wrote: Well for what it's worth... for about a year, AFS-610 wanted examiners to submit a report of how much time was spent on the oral, and flight portion of the sport pilot exams, so they could track how much time was being spent. My POI told me that the average time for orals was around the 1.5 to 2 hours mark for the oral portion of the exam.

1.5 to 2.0 hours on an initial rating oral would be acceptable. A little on the long side, but OK.

Attorneys and insurance companies are not what's making Sport Pilot Practical Exams take almost a whole day to complete.

DPE's for Private rides and up are subject to the same insurance and legal angles, but continue to effectively evaluate their applicants using a different attitude.

I don't think a pilot's instructor or examiner is any more culpable if that pilot is violated or has an accident, than the parent of a 19 y/o driver is.
Do you ever know of a situation where a new driver is charged with vehicular homicide, and the jury finds their parent who taught them to drive to be partially responsible? No.

Is that kid's License INVALID because the License Examiner did not take them onto the interstate? NO.

nbjeeptj · Joined: 23 Jun 2011 Posts: 46 Location: Gilbert SC

I guess by hardcore I really mean 100% by the book. He was very nice and made me feel at ease it just took a while and every thing had to be right. I would use him for a check ride again I would just know more what to expect and more about what he was looking for. I am not saying my CFI did not tell me he said to take my maint records but other than a current annual he did not dig into it and I did not know any better. Also in the time was adding fuel to match the weight and ballance work sheet I completed and preflight of the airplane. I did not want to scare anyone but if you are about to take your check ride be ready for a lot of questions and have all your paperwork 100%. Or you will likely be going back to the DPE again. The only reason my records not being right was ok was it was non mandatory equipment and it had to be turned off and labeled inop. If it had been that a annual was out of date or an AD not performed then we would not have completed the exam.