Sport Pilot Talk

goinaround · Joined: 18 Apr 2010 Posts: 68

I flew a ctls this morning for the first time and overall like it but the rudders pedals are stiff as hell, normal? I have flown an sw but it's been some time and I just don't remember them being so tight, on the ground or airborne.

rfane · Joined: 26 Apr 2006 Posts: 214 Location: Sunnyvale, CA

Controls in all axis are stiffer on the CTLS than on the CTSW. I flew an early LS that was like driving a 5 ton truck versus the Audi TT or Mazda Miata feel of my SW. This was one of the issues focused on by Flight Design after the early landing crash spree in the SW. It was felt that the lighter controls contributed to people overcontrolling the aircraft, especially in pitch. I personally thought they over did it.

Later deliveries of the LS are less stiff, but each control axis can also be adjusted to the owners preference.

tadel001 · Joined: 12 Mar 2007 Posts: 251

Roger, I had the exact oppposite experience. Controls in the SW were not balanced and laterally were very stiff. LS was more balanced. With that said, I think the SW I was flying was not 100% right. The LS was beautiful.

goinaround · Joined: 18 Apr 2010 Posts: 68

Thanks for the reply, I'm hopeing they will adjust some we shall see. I have it scheduled for friday. It doesn't feel that much different flying wise that I remember than the sw, except the stiff rudders, the sight picture is the same on landing and I swear that is the only really difficult part of flying it for me. Right now it's the only lsa in town besides an sw and I will adjust.

Cub flyer · Joined: 10 Sep 2006 Posts: 593

They installed the rudder centering springs on the SW we had while it was at Woodstock for windshield replacement in 06. I was complaining about yaw stability. Before they were installed if you tapped one rudder pedal or the other it would suck to the floor unless you held pressure on the other pedal. Flew by foot position more than feel. Pressures were light and with a little practice I was fine with it but the airplanes owner had a heck of a time. Ailerons were much heavier force than the elevator. This was an 05 with shorter balance/trim tab. Over controlling due to light forces was never the problem. The changes in control forces with deflection of the controls was.

After the springs were installed they appeared to be tension springs under the center floor which would not extend until you pushed one pedal or the other.

It felt like a detent at neutral rudder.

If you were in a right turn as you passed through neutral there was a definite stop where it would be no tension and then you had to push to break out of neutral. As the pedals started to move out of neutral you could back off the pressure. Forces were higher with the springs and during a turn it was more conventional in that the rudder would return towards center position without pushing the other pedal to bring it back.

The airplane was more yaw stable in cruise with the rudder acting like a fixed fin and not floating. But to maneuver with small turns it took attention not to overcontrol out of neutral rudder. Once you were established in the turn the forces were normal. Start turn push, push, pop whoops too much back off, pops back to neutral, push, PUSH, whoops. So it went. Steep turns were fine.

Springs which were partially extended in tension even at rest or compression springs like a spring rudder trim would have been better. Piper Colts have rudder centering springs which are long and always tensioned. There are several others. Cherokees have compression springs in the rudder trim. I have never seen a tension spring setup like they installed with no pressure at neutral.

I have no idea what was installed in the later CTSW or LS. I probably have a photo of the springs which were installed around here somewhere.

Couldn't the LS get rid of the springs with the longer tail boom? Seems like that would have been the time to make the necessary changes to the control surfaces with all the wind tunnel testing that was done.

I know I'll get a hundred messages saying "mine doesn't fly like that" I know and I think it was this particular airplane. Without the airplane here I can't demonstrate so I'm just describing what I had to work with.