Sport Pilot Talk

vacantstance · Joined: 20 Jul 2010 Posts: 22 Location: stafford, Va

I live in Northern Virginia and, as far as I can tell, the nearest light sport aircraft for rent is 90 miles away in Maryland. I plan to buy a plane one day, but my concern is my ability to "stay active" without having to drive a long way just to rent a plane, so my sport pilot certificate will probably be a step towards my PPL down the line.

Being that overly excited beginner, I picked up the Jeppesen Private Pilot ground school package, in addition to an ASA PRIVATE PILOT DVD study set on Ebay. It's all up to date but my FAR/AIM that came with what I consider a steal($110 for both)is 2010. My plan was to do a self paced study(because of my current schedule) and then be "evaluated" by the flight school of my choosing. I was actually hoping to pass the written on my own before I fly so my ground school could be more review than lesson. Besides, I would like the "hour in the air" I'm paying for to be as much of that hour in the air as possible.

How different is the Sport Pilot written from the Private Pilot written? Would my potential school accept a passed PPL written as a ground school requirement with maybe a few additional specific lessons? And most importantly, could I save money this way?

Helen · Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 119 Location: Maryland

There are a number of options for staying active after completing a sport pilot certificate without a lengthy commute. Some students build a plane. Others buy a plane. Buying a plane with several partners can make the plane much more affordable. Other students opt to add on PP privileges so they can buy a used GA plane.

The FAA requires that the written test you take match the practical test that you take. Now that being said, private pilot study materials are fine to use to study for a sport pilot exam as long as you supplement them by studying sport pilot regulations and Rotax systems. Learning to fly an airplane is learning to fly an airplane regardless of certificate level sought.

We typically don't have our students take the written exam until they are rather far along in their training. By then they have a much more comprehensive understanding of the material and they can make a better choice for which exam they wish to take.

Helen

spooky981 · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 45

vacantstance wrote: I live in Northern Virginia and, as far as I can tell, the nearest light sport aircraft for rent is 90 miles away in Maryland. I plan to buy a plane one day, but my concern is my ability to "stay active" without having to drive a long way just to rent a plane, so my sport pilot certificate will probably be a step towards my PPL down the line.

Being that overly excited beginner, I picked up the Jeppesen Private Pilot ground school package, in addition to an ASA PRIVATE PILOT DVD study set on Ebay. It's all up to date but my FAR/AIM that came with what I consider a steal($110 for both)is 2010. My plan was to do a self paced study(because of my current schedule) and then be "evaluated" by the flight school of my choosing. I was actually hoping to pass the written on my own before I fly so my ground school could be more review than lesson. Besides, I would like the "hour in the air" I'm paying for to be as much of that hour in the air as possible.

How different is the Sport Pilot written from the Private Pilot written? Would my potential school accept a passed PPL written as a ground school requirement with maybe a few additional specific lessons? And most importantly, could I save money this way?

As a current student approximately 80% through the process, I have a recommendation for you: Do ground school and flight school at the same time. I could write a novel on the reasons why, but hopefully you'll take the advice of somebody who is a couple months ahead of you in the same position. The information just doesn't stick without the experience to relate to it. Alternatively experiencing something in the air, then reading about it in ground school, enhances the effectiveness of both lessons.

There's a new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg, MD by the way.

vacantstance · Joined: 20 Jul 2010 Posts: 22 Location: stafford, Va

spooky981 wrote: vacantstance wrote: I live in Northern Virginia and, as far as I can tell, the nearest light sport aircraft for rent is 90 miles away in Maryland. I plan to buy a plane one day, but my concern is my ability to "stay active" without having to drive a long way just to rent a plane, so my sport pilot certificate will probably be a step towards my PPL down the line.

Being that overly excited beginner, I picked up the Jeppesen Private Pilot ground school package, in addition to an ASA PRIVATE PILOT DVD study set on Ebay. It's all up to date but my FAR/AIM that came with what I consider a steal($110 for both)is 2010. My plan was to do a self paced study(because of my current schedule) and then be "evaluated" by the flight school of my choosing. I was actually hoping to pass the written on my own before I fly so my ground school could be more review than lesson. Besides, I would like the "hour in the air" I'm paying for to be as much of that hour in the air as possible.

How different is the Sport Pilot written from the Private Pilot written? Would my potential school accept a passed PPL written as a ground school requirement with maybe a few additional specific lessons? And most importantly, could I save money this way?

As a current student approximately 80% through the process, I have a recommendation for you: Do ground school and flight school at the same time. I could write a novel on the reasons why, but hopefully you'll take the advice of somebody who is a couple months ahead of you in the same position. The information just doesn't stick without the experience to relate to it. Alternatively experiencing something in the air, then reading about it in ground school, enhances the effectiveness of both lessons.

There's a new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg, MD by the way.

Yeah, I've pretty much decided to do ground school and flight school together. You are the latest in a long line of pilots and student pilots to suggest that it's best to do them congruently.

What's the name of the new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg? Is there a website?

rsteele · Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 261

Aviation Adventures in Manassas, VA has a Champ. I've no experience with them, and don't know if they have a Sport Pilot course, per se. I drove the 100mi door to door to train at CSP ("Helen" above) and can say that they are a first rate school. The problem is that with DC traffic you can be so stressed when you get there, that you really need to allow some time to "come down" from the traffic before you "go up" in the plane. Also weather at Bay Bridge can be quite different than in Virginia, so plan accordingly. You will learn to obsess about weather (like all pilots, I suppose, maybe it's good practice!)

I have the ASA SP course on CD. I'm willing to give it away to a good home. It's a couple of years old, but there are very few changes. PM me if you are interested.

Ron

ka7eej · Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 177 Location: Taylor, Az

Written test is only good for two years... only take it if you are going to finish up within two years... There is really little reason to hurry to pass the written...

Brian

ArionAv8or · Joined: 20 Mar 2010 Posts: 271

ka7eej wrote: Written test is only good for two years... only take it if you are going to finish up within two years... There is really little reason to hurry to pass the written...
Brian

I guess there are two schools of thought on this one. The flight school where I did my lessons wanted the written completed before your second or third lesson. They felt it would provide you with a better base of knowledge to learn from and they wanted nothing to stand in the way of your training. Once you were ready to solo you were ready to solo, you didn't have to wait or worry about passing the test. They also felt that once the test was completed that was one less stress the student would have hanging over his/her head. I personally am glad I took mine early and when we were aloft I actually had a lot better idea what was going on since I had already studied and completed the test. I am sure it works both ways and everyone learns at their own pace, IMO.

FLA-CFI · Joined: 27 Oct 2008 Posts: 45

Snip... ArionAv8or wrote: Once you were ready to solo you were ready to solo, you didn't have to wait or worry about passing the test.

The written test isn't a requirement for solo. There is a take home written test that your instructor has to give you before you can solo....this is different than the written test being discussed here.

ArionAv8or · Joined: 20 Mar 2010 Posts: 271

FLA-CFI wrote: Snip... ArionAv8or wrote: Once you were ready to solo you were ready to solo, you didn't have to wait or worry about passing the test.

The written test isn't a requirement for solo. There is a take home written test that your instructor has to give you before you can solo....this is different than the written test being discussed here.

The written test you are referring to is the Presolo Aeronautical Knowledge test and I am well aware of that one. But once again, the flight school where I took my lessons wants the written test completed before your first solo flight. I never said it was rule or law, just that it is the way they wanted it done. I hope this clarifies the difference if flight school training for you.

vacantstance · Joined: 20 Jul 2010 Posts: 22 Location: stafford, Va

rsteele wrote: Aviation Adventures in Manassas, VA has a Champ. I've no experience with them, and don't know if they have a Sport Pilot course, per se. I drove the 100mi door to door to train at CSP ("Helen" above) and can say that they are a first rate school. The problem is that with DC traffic you can be so stressed when you get there, that you really need to allow some time to "come down" from the traffic before you "go up" in the plane. Also weather at Bay Bridge can be quite different than in Virginia, so plan accordingly. You will learn to obsess about weather (like all pilots, I suppose, maybe it's good practice!)

I have the ASA SP course on CD. I'm willing to give it away to a good home. It's a couple of years old, but there are very few changes. PM me if you are interested.

Ron

CSP's a 100 mile trek for me as well and not only do I have to take the Bay Bridge, I have to contend with I-95. Not sure I could even come down off of the stress of that drive. I'm in no hurry so I'm considering every scenario for the flight training, maybe even the condensed course on like two weeks of vacation somewhere.

I considered Aviation Adventures for sport pilot and private pilot lessons. I inquired at the Warrenton-Fauquier Airport(HWY) because it's closer to me. I was told that AA has purchased 3 new LSAs, one for each location and they are projecting that they will be available in 2011. I also looked into Dulles aviation in Manassas(KHEF). I did a demo with them in a Cessna C 172SP and I've been hooked ever since. I'm concentrating on sport pilot training mainly because of the attainable financial requirements right now.($4k would knock my wife down, but $10k would probably knock her out) Besides, I can spend less than half the cost of a PPL on the sport pilot certificate, enjoy flying and possibly get more than half the required hours in to boot.

I'm going to concentrate on my own self paced ground school(and weight loss) until I either book a vacation and do an accelerated course or something closer opens up.

spooky981 · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 45

vacantstance wrote: spooky981 wrote: vacantstance wrote: I live in Northern Virginia and, as far as I can tell, the nearest light sport aircraft for rent is 90 miles away in Maryland. I plan to buy a plane one day, but my concern is my ability to "stay active" without having to drive a long way just to rent a plane, so my sport pilot certificate will probably be a step towards my PPL down the line.

Being that overly excited beginner, I picked up the Jeppesen Private Pilot ground school package, in addition to an ASA PRIVATE PILOT DVD study set on Ebay. It's all up to date but my FAR/AIM that came with what I consider a steal($110 for both)is 2010. My plan was to do a self paced study(because of my current schedule) and then be "evaluated" by the flight school of my choosing. I was actually hoping to pass the written on my own before I fly so my ground school could be more review than lesson. Besides, I would like the "hour in the air" I'm paying for to be as much of that hour in the air as possible.

How different is the Sport Pilot written from the Private Pilot written? Would my potential school accept a passed PPL written as a ground school requirement with maybe a few additional specific lessons? And most importantly, could I save money this way?

As a current student approximately 80% through the process, I have a recommendation for you: Do ground school and flight school at the same time. I could write a novel on the reasons why, but hopefully you'll take the advice of somebody who is a couple months ahead of you in the same position. The information just doesn't stick without the experience to relate to it. Alternatively experiencing something in the air, then reading about it in ground school, enhances the effectiveness of both lessons.

There's a new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg, MD by the way.

Yeah, I've pretty much decided to do ground school and flight school together. You are the latest in a long line of pilots and student pilots to suggest that it's best to do them congruently.

What's the name of the new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg? Is there a website?

Fleming Aviation at www.flemingaviation.com

vacantstance · Joined: 20 Jul 2010 Posts: 22 Location: stafford, Va

spooky981 wrote: vacantstance wrote: spooky981 wrote: vacantstance wrote: I live in Northern Virginia and, as far as I can tell, the nearest light sport aircraft for rent is 90 miles away in Maryland. I plan to buy a plane one day, but my concern is my ability to "stay active" without having to drive a long way just to rent a plane, so my sport pilot certificate will probably be a step towards my PPL down the line.

Being that overly excited beginner, I picked up the Jeppesen Private Pilot ground school package, in addition to an ASA PRIVATE PILOT DVD study set on Ebay. It's all up to date but my FAR/AIM that came with what I consider a steal($110 for both)is 2010. My plan was to do a self paced study(because of my current schedule) and then be "evaluated" by the flight school of my choosing. I was actually hoping to pass the written on my own before I fly so my ground school could be more review than lesson. Besides, I would like the "hour in the air" I'm paying for to be as much of that hour in the air as possible.

How different is the Sport Pilot written from the Private Pilot written? Would my potential school accept a passed PPL written as a ground school requirement with maybe a few additional specific lessons? And most importantly, could I save money this way?

As a current student approximately 80% through the process, I have a recommendation for you: Do ground school and flight school at the same time. I could write a novel on the reasons why, but hopefully you'll take the advice of somebody who is a couple months ahead of you in the same position. The information just doesn't stick without the experience to relate to it. Alternatively experiencing something in the air, then reading about it in ground school, enhances the effectiveness of both lessons.

There's a new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg, MD by the way.

Yeah, I've pretty much decided to do ground school and flight school together. You are the latest in a long line of pilots and student pilots to suggest that it's best to do them congruently.

What's the name of the new sport pilot school in Gaithersburg? Is there a website?

Fleming Aviation at www.flemingaviation.com

Alas, I'm too heavy. :(
Oh well, back to the diet/saving/flightsim/Cessna 150 shopping.

Fleming does, however, have a great ground school syllabus you can follow on their website. I'm groundschooling myself so I've been looking for such a guideline.

Paul Hamilton · Joined: 21 May 2007 Posts: 351 Location: Reno/Tahoe Nevada

There is confusion as to what ground school really is. Let me share with you the three types of ground school.

It should be understood that “Ground School” has evolved over the years to be “studying to pass the FAA knowledge test”. As far as the commonly advertised “Ground School” goes, nothing is further from the TRUTH. With all the popular “ground schools” from the leading publishers, do not expect a comprehensive ground school to help you get your sport pilot certificate.

Expect to get something that only gets you through the FAA knowledge test. I work and help design knowledge test prep materials called “ground school”, and the objective is to teach you only the information to get you through the knowledge test questions as simply and easily as possible. Let me note here that an instructor is required by law to teach you the aeronautical knowledge to be a pilot, which is above and beyond the FAA knowledge test.

Understanding the important things that keep you safe and flying confidently are the first and most important things you should learn in GROUND SCHOOL. Unfortunately, this most important knowledge is not taught for the classical “knowledge test prep” ground school.

“Ground School ” is actually three specific areas of knowledge:

1. Learning the flight and aircraft operation procedures before getting in the cockpit, the most fun part of ground school.

2. Leaning the aeronautical knowledge (weather, sectionals, cross country, etc.). This is also an interesting part of ground school that is used to become a safe pilot.

3. Learning the answers to the FAA Questions to pass the knowledge test. This is the least interesting and sometimes the scariest. It requires unnecessary time spent and additional memory recall required, and does us the least good.

Yes, some of the information for items 1 and 2 above are in 3, the knowledge test prep, but the knowledge test prep is only 20% of the ground school that you need to learn.

Note that the “knowledge test prep” ground school is required, but it doesn’t necessarily have to be at the beginning of flight training, or the more important ground school. The FAA Knowledge test is simply some measure of the applicants ability to remember some of the concepts, plus the regulations.

It is much more efficient and cost effective, if you can learn the fun and most important stuff first (items 1 and 2 above) on the ground…in “Ground School”, rather than using the cockpit as the classroom. You are paying 3 to 5 times more for learn the knowledge in the cockpit than your would for the same knowledge learned in the classroom. Do not worry, all the fun ground school builds towards the final phase of “3 ground school” to take the FAA Knowledge Test and the Checkride. It is easier to learn the information and then be able to answer the FAA questions, when memorize the questions and answers.

The best resources for ground school are the FAA handbooks “Pilot’s Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge” 8083-25A and the “Airplane Flying Handbook” 8083-3A. These should be your reference books for all your ground schools and preparing for the Checkride also. I have modified/enhanced both these books for sport pilots flying LSA as a downloadable PDF. This allows you to know that to study and what not to study plus add important information. If you want a complete “ground school” covering all three needed topics visit the Hamilton Pilot Training System for more details. This is specific for sport pilots.
www.sport-pilot-training.com

vacantstance · Joined: 20 Jul 2010 Posts: 22 Location: stafford, Va

Paul Hamilton wrote: There is confusion as to what ground school really is. Let me share with you the three types of ground school.

It should be understood that “Ground School” has evolved over the years to be “studying to pass the FAA knowledge test”. As far as the commonly advertised “Ground School” goes, nothing is further from the TRUTH. With all the popular “ground schools” from the leading publishers, do not expect a comprehensive ground school to help you get your sport pilot certificate.

Expect to get something that only gets you through the FAA knowledge test. I work and help design knowledge test prep materials called “ground school”, and the objective is to teach you only the information to get you through the knowledge test questions as simply and easily as possible. Let me note here that an instructor is required by law to teach you the aeronautical knowledge to be a pilot, which is above and beyond the FAA knowledge test.

Understanding the important things that keep you safe and flying confidently are the first and most important things you should learn in GROUND SCHOOL. Unfortunately, this most important knowledge is not taught for the classical “knowledge test prep” ground school.

“Ground School ” is actually three specific areas of knowledge:

1. Learning the flight and aircraft operation procedures before getting in the cockpit, the most fun part of ground school.

2. Leaning the aeronautical knowledge (weather, sectionals, cross country, etc.). This is also an interesting part of ground school that is used to become a safe pilot.

3. Learning the answers to the FAA Questions to pass the knowledge test. This is the least interesting and sometimes the scariest. It requires unnecessary time spent and additional memory recall required, and does us the least good.

Yes, some of the information for items 1 and 2 above are in 3, the knowledge test prep, but the knowledge test prep is only 20% of the ground school that you need to learn.

Note that the “knowledge test prep” ground school is required, but it doesn’t necessarily have to be at the beginning of flight training, or the more important ground school. The FAA Knowledge test is simply some measure of the applicants ability to remember some of the concepts, plus the regulations.

It is much more efficient and cost effective, if you can learn the fun and most important stuff first (items 1 and 2 above) on the ground…in “Ground School”, rather than using the cockpit as the classroom. You are paying 3 to 5 times more for learn the knowledge in the cockpit than your would for the same knowledge learned in the classroom. Do not worry, all the fun ground school builds towards the final phase of “3 ground school” to take the FAA Knowledge Test and the Checkride. It is easier to learn the information and then be able to answer the FAA questions, when memorize the questions and answers.

The best resources for ground school are the FAA handbooks “Pilot’s Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge” 8083-25A and the “Airplane Flying Handbook” 8083-3A. These should be your reference books for all your ground schools and preparing for the Checkride also. I have modified/enhanced both these books for sport pilots flying LSA as a downloadable PDF. This allows you to know that to study and what not to study plus add important information. If you want a complete “ground school” covering all three needed topics visit the Hamilton Pilot Training System for more details. This is specific for sport pilots.
www.sport-pilot-training.com

Let me start by saying that I'm a huge fan of yours Mr. Hamilton. Your resources are rich with knowledge and I've learned a lot watching your videos and perusing your website.

Thanks for the great info! I was a bit confused regarding what is required and what will help me be a safe pilot some day. I have both the 8083-25a & 8083-3a that came in my Jeppesen kit and I also have the ASA virtual test prep dvds.

As rsteele pointed out, Aviation Adventures in Manassas has a Champ 7ac but it's only used for tailwheel endorsements. They will take delivery on 4 Cessna 162 Skycatchers in January so my plan is to continue to save, diet, study my materials and fly my X plane simulator until I'm either cash ready to pursue my PPL or I'm light enough to take the LSA course at Fleming Aviation or Aviation Adventures.